Elite 8 Bhangra Invitational 2015: Judges' scores & other notes

Elite 8 Bhangra

New Member
Messages
128
Our judging process was enhanced and improved based on feedback from past competing captains. This year, the process was a healthy balance of points and deliberation. In keeping with our tradition to be completely transparent, we are attaching the following for your review and reference:
  • Judging Presentation: Lays out the process of judging
  • Master Score Sheet: The scores were entered independently by two separate Elite 8 Bhangra team members into the programmed Excel file to ensure verification
Other notes:
  • FAUJ: We played their incorrect mix during the show performance. This is due to our fault completely. An updated mix had been submitted that morning before tech rehearsal. After their performance, we gave them an opportunity go again, which they declined. The captains were allowed to meet with the judges before points were finalized and submitted.
  • FAUJ: They violated one of the rules laid out by the venue and competition regarding use of an open flame therefore the Technical Judge deducted points based on their own discretion.
  • FCB: Their audio track ceased to play due to a technical error caused by crowd control. This is due to our fault completely. We tried to stop the performance but did not force a complete stop as the team wanted to keep dancing. After their performance, w[SIZE=small]e gave them an opportunity go again, which they declined. The captains were allowed to meet with the judges before points were finalized and submitted.[/SIZE]
[font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif][/size]Again, we sincerely apologize to members of the affected teams due to our technical errors.[size=small][/font]
 

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Psant

UNC Bhangra Elite Alum, Brandeis Bhangra
Messages
434
Crazy that JJ would have won even with no Elite points on top.
 

IAmCaptainMorgan

New Member
Messages
24
All competitions should move towards doing this. No matter how things went this weekend, transparency and accountability are always appreciated.
 

JSaw

New Member
Messages
20
absurd that a competition named "Elite" would make such critical mistakes to two of the 8 teams competing.
 

jfried

Member
Messages
502
The Elite points mechanic is an interesting idea, but I think that it got a bit weird in that FCB won in 1/2 execution and choreo categories and yet didn't get any elite points. I kind of feel like it would have made more sense to either do it as a bonus 1-2 points or just get rid of it altogether.
 

Harmeet

Active Member
Messages
127
I'm glad it wasn't my team's music that got stopped half way through. I would be HOT. All that hard work for 8 minutes and that happens. Very unprofessional by the committee.

Side note: No one should be allowed to turn in a mix the day of your tech time. That's just a lack of being prepared.
 

sganesha

New Member
Messages
17
jfried said:
The Elite points mechanic is an interesting idea, but I think that it got a bit weird in that FCB won in 1/2 execution and choreo categories and yet didn't get any elite points. I kind of feel like it would have made more sense to either do it as a bonus 1-2 points or just get rid of it altogether.

I agree that its interesting idea, especially since it is awarded after deliberation. However, I think it should be decreased to a maximum of 4 pts, preferably 2-3 (no more than half the maximum a judge can give based on the rubric which I believe is 8). In this case, it was pretty unanimous across the board who the judges felt should have won (which is ideal), but in the case it isn't, I think 5 pts on top of the category score is way too much and can bring the emphasis away from the rubric.
 

Sid

Member
Messages
54
Harmeet said:
Side note: No one should be allowed to turn in a mix the day of your tech time. That's just a lack of being prepared.
I don't agree with this. Yes it can happen because of lack of preparation, but it can also happen due to pursuit of perfection. With a competition of Elite's caliber, I think the latter is more likely the case. Honestly as long as the committee has received a mix of the appropriate format and length then what's the issue? Competitions tend to assign arbitrarily early deadlines for things like lighting cues and mix. (on this note, shout out to Bhangra Fever and Kevin Acker for understanding completely and not requiring anything until day of comp. This was great for us, and everything went smoothly).

Thing with the mix is - you are most likely going to practice with rough mix cuts and then once you have finalized beats, transitions and everything you will actually do the final, mastered mix. This last step is likely when you add in the effects to compliment your choreo and gimmicks, and clean up transitions, layer in more bass etc. I don't see this as lack of preparation.
 

sartajjudge

New Member
Messages
609
Sid said:
Harmeet said:
Side note: No one should be allowed to turn in a mix the day of your tech time. That's just a lack of being prepared.
I don't agree with this. Yes it can happen because of lack of preparation, but it can also happen due to pursuit of perfection. With a competition of Elite's caliber, I think the latter is more likely the case. Honestly as long as the committee has received a mix of the appropriate format and length then what's the issue? Competitions tend to assign arbitrarily early deadlines for things like lighting cues and mix. (on this note, shout out to Bhangra Fever and Kevin Acker for understanding completely and not requiring anything until day of comp. This was great for us, and everything went smoothly).

Thing with the mix is - you are most likely going to practice with rough mix cuts and then once you have finalized beats, transitions and everything you will actually do the final, mastered mix. This last step is likely when you add in the effects to compliment your choreo and gimmicks, and clean up transitions, layer in more bass etc. I don't see this as lack of preparation.

I agree, I think the early deadlines are arbitrary and a final mix should be due at the mixer (or by then)- which is usually the evening before the competition.
 

Mukandpuria

New Member
Messages
1,413
Just to add on. Yes the mix was updated, thank you being accommodating. To keep full transparency as to what happened, the correct mix was played at the dress rehearsal and the wrong was played at the show.
 

SGupta7

Member
Messages
109
I don't like the idea of having "Elite" points, especially if they are awarded after deliberation. Elite points should be awarded by each judge individually without deliberation and without knowing what the other judge's decision is. Elite points should help drive consensus, not the other way around. The fact that all four judges gave Elite points to JJ seems a little too good to be true, but maybe thats just me.


Also, mix/lighting/etc. should 100% be allowed to be changed. The fact that teams were allowed to change has nothing to do with the technical malfunctions that occurred the day of the show. Nearly every competition i've been to has allowed us to submit an updated mix and it's never caused a problem before.
 

Pendu

New Member
Messages
23
SGupta7 said:
I don't like the idea of having "Elite" points, especially if they are awarded after deliberation. Elite points should be awarded by each judge individually without deliberation and without knowing what the other judge's decision is. Elite points should help drive consensus, not the other way around. The fact that all four judges gave Elite points to JJ seems a little too good to be true, but maybe thats just me.


Also, mix/lighting/etc. should 100% be allowed to be changed. The fact that teams were allowed to change has nothing to do with the technical malfunctions that occurred the day of the show. Nearly every competition i've been to has allowed us to submit an updated mix and it's never caused a problem before.

JJ would have won regardless if going by point totals before the elite points were even added, so it doesn't seem far fetched that all the judges would agree upon awarding them the elite points. Though I do agree in general, if theres going to be a factor like that that could easily sway the results it should be decided individually prior to deliberation.
 

SGupta7

Member
Messages
109
Yes, JJ would have still won by points and I definitely think they were in the discussion of most "Elite" team of the night. But the fact that deliberation occurred before Elite points were awarded allows judges to be swayed based on a group consensus. Now all of a sudden JJ was 20.5 points better than the next closest team vs. a potentially smaller difference. It just makes the spread seem bigger than it actually was in my opinion.


Seems like judges should make that "Elite" distinction on their own and not allow deliberation to change their minds on what is essentially a "Which set was most memorable to you" category. It's the one category where judges can allow their own individuality to present itself vs. coming to a group decision. I'm not saying that that necessarily happened, i'm just saying the possibility of it happening is enough to make me think the category isn't helpful for judging. Certainly not trying to take anything away from an awesome performance by JJ!
 
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