-
Bhangra discussion is still going strong. Join us in our Facebook group!
New user registration has been closed (as it was entirely spam). We encourage you to post in our Facebook group, even if it's a followup to an existing thread. BTF will continue to be archived and hosted here - Saleem
Is this disrespectful to punjabi culture??
- Thread starter jaz89
- Start date
KingGeorge
New Member
- Messages
- 664
was she hot
gursikhpreet1
Member
- Messages
- 272
+1 for end-tagging a rant hahah.GSingh said:
i personally would find smoking in a vardi disrespectful- but i guess it's one of those live and let live situations. and yeah smoking before a performance might not be the best idea haha
campy614
New Member
- Messages
- 666
This is just my personal take on things.
I'm not one of those people who thinks of everything he does as "respecting or disrespecting culture/family/religion." If I get out of work and meet a few friends for a beer still in shirt and tie, I don't think of it as me "being disrespectful to my job/heritage/family for going out for a drink." I wouldn't feel any differently if I was wearing a crucifix under my shirt.
Before I represent anything (my family, religion, ethnicity, etc), I represent myself. I do not care what others think about me. I don't see anyone else paying my bills. I don't see anyone else doing my day job for me. Go ahead, pass judgment. There's a lot of other, more important, issues that I deal with on a daily basis.
As a single male living in New York City, I live for myself. One day that'll change, and I'll have kids to raise. And as a father, I'll want to bring them up properly (and teach them NOT to do all of the things that I've done)... but that day isn't today (and it isn't for most of you either).
Now that this is off my chest, I don't think it's disrespectful to smoke a cigarette in vardiyan. Smoking cigs before a performance is just a bad idea.
As far as drinking in vardiyan:
a) I wouldn't drink before a performance because I'd feel sluggish.
b) Most comps don't allow alcohol in the venue/backstage (that is, if there is a backstage) anyway.
c) After a performance, I want to watch other teams and enjoy the show with my friends. I could care less about drinking (or smoking a cigarette, for the same reason).
I'm not one of those people who thinks of everything he does as "respecting or disrespecting culture/family/religion." If I get out of work and meet a few friends for a beer still in shirt and tie, I don't think of it as me "being disrespectful to my job/heritage/family for going out for a drink." I wouldn't feel any differently if I was wearing a crucifix under my shirt.
Before I represent anything (my family, religion, ethnicity, etc), I represent myself. I do not care what others think about me. I don't see anyone else paying my bills. I don't see anyone else doing my day job for me. Go ahead, pass judgment. There's a lot of other, more important, issues that I deal with on a daily basis.
As a single male living in New York City, I live for myself. One day that'll change, and I'll have kids to raise. And as a father, I'll want to bring them up properly (and teach them NOT to do all of the things that I've done)... but that day isn't today (and it isn't for most of you either).
Now that this is off my chest, I don't think it's disrespectful to smoke a cigarette in vardiyan. Smoking cigs before a performance is just a bad idea.
As far as drinking in vardiyan:
a) I wouldn't drink before a performance because I'd feel sluggish.
b) Most comps don't allow alcohol in the venue/backstage (that is, if there is a backstage) anyway.
c) After a performance, I want to watch other teams and enjoy the show with my friends. I could care less about drinking (or smoking a cigarette, for the same reason).
To all the guys that were asking, yes i'm pretty sure it was before their performance! lol this was right at the start of the show while the first team had gone on...
I think if you're a religious person your views on whether it's disrespectful or not are inevitably going to be coloured, even if you try your best to try and take that aspect out of the equation. As a Sikh, I view drinking alcohol and smoking as completely wrong so i do find it difficult trying to see it any other way. Of course, as has been said religion is separate and different from culture (even though sometimes there may be some overlap).
The way i see it, there's primarily 2 questions on hand here.
No.1 Just because someone's wearing a bhangra virdi, should they change the way they behave and act accordingly? Or does it not matter?
No.2 What is Punjabi culture really? How do you determine if something is in agreement with or against a culture?
In answer to no.1, i know a lot of people have mentioned the whole 'live and let live' argument already and how people should do what they want to do and it doesn't make a difference what they wear. I have to agree and disagree with this. People have the right to do whatever the heck they want to do, and others should try hard not to judge them on their actions and let them live life they way they want to. However, this still doesn't address whether their actions are disrespectful or not, regardless of what anyone else thinks. If you're wearing traditional Punjabi clothing, there's a sense of responsibility and honour that comes with that (the way i see it anyway).
Not only is that your heritage, you're representing your community and your culture when you're in those clothes, whether you like it or not. So whatever you do while you're donning a bhangra outfit will in moral principle, if not on someone's perception, have an impact.
In answer to no.2, people view culture in different ways. When something like drinking becomes socially acceptable AND common in a society, people immediately jump to calling that their 'culture'. If that was the case, then drugs would soon in the near future be part of Punjabi culture as well. Because if anything is big in Punjab at the moment, it's drugs. Would most people agree with that? Of course they wouldn't. I find it personally insulting to Punjabi culture to attach things like alcohol, drugs, female foeticide to it. These things are extremely prevalent and huge issues, but i wouldn't say they're a part of the culture. They're things that have polluted it over time. What makes a culture for me? It's the language, the traditions, the music, the folklore, the history, the literature, the ideals, the personalities, the principles. That's what Punjabi culture is for me, not any other rubbish.
So, personally i do think it's disrespectful. But to each their own
I think if you're a religious person your views on whether it's disrespectful or not are inevitably going to be coloured, even if you try your best to try and take that aspect out of the equation. As a Sikh, I view drinking alcohol and smoking as completely wrong so i do find it difficult trying to see it any other way. Of course, as has been said religion is separate and different from culture (even though sometimes there may be some overlap).
The way i see it, there's primarily 2 questions on hand here.
No.1 Just because someone's wearing a bhangra virdi, should they change the way they behave and act accordingly? Or does it not matter?
No.2 What is Punjabi culture really? How do you determine if something is in agreement with or against a culture?
In answer to no.1, i know a lot of people have mentioned the whole 'live and let live' argument already and how people should do what they want to do and it doesn't make a difference what they wear. I have to agree and disagree with this. People have the right to do whatever the heck they want to do, and others should try hard not to judge them on their actions and let them live life they way they want to. However, this still doesn't address whether their actions are disrespectful or not, regardless of what anyone else thinks. If you're wearing traditional Punjabi clothing, there's a sense of responsibility and honour that comes with that (the way i see it anyway).
Not only is that your heritage, you're representing your community and your culture when you're in those clothes, whether you like it or not. So whatever you do while you're donning a bhangra outfit will in moral principle, if not on someone's perception, have an impact.
In answer to no.2, people view culture in different ways. When something like drinking becomes socially acceptable AND common in a society, people immediately jump to calling that their 'culture'. If that was the case, then drugs would soon in the near future be part of Punjabi culture as well. Because if anything is big in Punjab at the moment, it's drugs. Would most people agree with that? Of course they wouldn't. I find it personally insulting to Punjabi culture to attach things like alcohol, drugs, female foeticide to it. These things are extremely prevalent and huge issues, but i wouldn't say they're a part of the culture. They're things that have polluted it over time. What makes a culture for me? It's the language, the traditions, the music, the folklore, the history, the literature, the ideals, the personalities, the principles. That's what Punjabi culture is for me, not any other rubbish.
So, personally i do think it's disrespectful. But to each their own
HarmanSingh
New Member
- Messages
- 531
While I get what you are saying, circumstances are vastly different for a person of color (from a community which has been viewed as distinctly un-American post 9.11) than they are for someone who is white. For example, I went to a school where I was the only Sikh, and the only person who wore a pagg. My actions were viewed as a reflection on all people who wore paggs (which is damn unfair). But the actions of white students were never reflective of white Americans, they only represented themselves.campy614 said:
In an ideal world I wouldn't have to shoulder the weight or burden of my entire community. But in reality, that is exactly how it goes for certain minority communities.
campy614
New Member
- Messages
- 666
Totally see your point. Somewhat agree with it, somewhat don't.HarmanSingh said:
It's very easy to group white people together, even though white Americans do nothing but try to separate themselves from the rest and sterotype each other based on their probably-European heritage. Italians-Amerians have bad tempers and are all mob related (I really can't argue there); Irish-Americans drink too much; Germans all have some "if only WWII worked out differently" mentality; the Polish are stupid beyond belief; WASPs rule the country but are assholes and wouldn't know their asses from their elbows... etc etc etc and the list of bullshit stereotypes can keep going.
If a guy named Brian McMullen gets trashed at a bar, we all think "Damn Irish people need to stop getting drunk!" Italian-American person gets angry at a manager at a Target (PS don't be surprised if the woman is my mother), and everyone thinks "Woman's Italian. She needs to calm down. I'd tell her that so it could be settled, but I don't want her to send her probably mafioso ::insert relative here:: after me."
But the scenario wasn't posted on this forum to people of other groups. The story about someone who likely has some sort of Punjabi and/or Indian heritage and was performing at a show with a probably large Indian/Punjabi-heritaged audience was posted in a forum where a very large number of readers also have Indian/Punjabi roots. This isn't really judgment by other groups-this is judgment within a group.
Each group (again, breaking apart that large "white people" group into it's smaller subgroups) has its own code of conduct that is constituted of moral and social "rights and wrongs." All social groups have different codes of conduct.
But my piece is regardless of who is watching me/passing judgment-whether a WASP, a Punjabi, or a fellow Calabrese-American (Italian-Americans have subgroups, each with their own code of conduct)-nobody pays my bills or does my work. If I cared what other Italian-Americans thought about me, I wouldn't have joined a bhangra team in the first place.
The way I think formulates my ideas on why I don't necessarily think this person was being disrespectful to Punjabi culture. It's a cigarette-nothing more, nothing less. Now if that person decided to take the vardi off, throw it in a trashcan and light it on fire-THAT would be another story.