A MUST READ--> United States: Practicing new age imperialism (Part I)

[Summy]

Nazi Germany, Stalin led Communism, Mussolini's facist Italy... Brutal governments who practiced less than proper actions at home and with their foreign policy. Some people believe the United States should be added to that list.

Recently some well known scholars mainly studying post colonial actions, believe the United States have committed acts that would be able to distinguish them as imperialists, and add them to this not so admirable group. Lets start with the basics of Imperialism, and let me make the case for you. Why being proud to be an American is drawing parrallels to being proud to be a nazi, or a communist.

PART I: Cultural Imperialism at home and abroad.

(1) Cultural Imperialism:

Cultural Imperialism is basically exporting one's culture, or basic values into another country or set of countries. This can be from invasive measures like war, or less invasive measure such a political manuervering. Lets start at home, because when you look at cultural imperialism as a whole, it includes influencing people in your country who may have cultural connections at HOME-- LISTEN UP BHANGRA DANCERS...

Edward Said, a founding figure in post colonial theory and a University of Columbia Professor, claimed that what the US does at home to immigrants and decents of immigrants is nothing sort than imperalistic actions seen in India, Africa and all over the world.

"So influential has been the discourse insisting on American specialness, altruism and opportunity, that imperialism in the United States as a word or ideology has turned up...the connection between imperial politics and culture in North America, and in particular in the United States, is astonishingly direct"

HE argues that in America, non-citizens and immigrants (plus direct decendents) are taught american imperialism who notions are based in prejudice thought. "The American dream (rags to riches) only being possible in america" is something that is thrown around by the presidential candidates that I find problematic. This prejudice thought is usually justified through ideas such as the "White man's burden". The White man's burden was a poem written by Rudyard Kipling (remember discussing him) a man born into the British Raj, who sided with the raj and enacted policies that would reduce the indian identity.

Goes a lil sum like dis:

Take up the White Man's burden--
The savage wars of peace--
Fill full the mouth of Famine
And bid the sickness cease;
And when your goal is nearest
The end for others sought,
Watch sloth and heathen Folly
Bring all your hopes to naught

Basically the notions put forth by this poem suggest that imperialism is a noble enterprise, and almost the duty of a white man. What you have been taught since childhood is the noble aspect of your country and the savageness of the rest. The United states has taught you to abandon your alligences, your love, your care for your previous country, as they are in need of fixing.

The White Man's BURDEN, the important word there, tell's us that the white man is forcefully making the world better. I REALLY REALLY WANT to go into bhangra and give THAT as an example of how something cultural significant was pimped out as an "entertainment" and how the cultural signifcance was compeltely stripped, but that will be off on a tangent... I could say how when one contributes to the pimping of a cultural art, they are in one way or another supporting imperialistic notions of demeaning their own culture but I wont....

I am going to keep this short... AT home, in the United States (not in Canada, our greatest hero was not a secularist like Lincoln, our greatest hero was Trudeau, a man who is responsible for allowing every immigrant in Canada to come here) you are taught that your oppertunities are great here, and are less around the world. Is that right? Is it true? American culture promotes the stripping of religiously, and cultural identity, and enacts a sense of superiority of one's own land, something distinctive to your land...


Cultural Imperialism abroad... Keep it short... Democracy in a country that has been practicing something differently for hundreds of years? Righting a countries wrong? Pushing forth a countries poltical intiatives and mixing it with cultural correctiveness...



How do people feel about the United States being aligned with Nazis, and communists? Cultural imperialism something that we are all a victim of, and reinforcer at the same time...

 

[HarmanSingh]

Summy, I think it is time someone addresses this notion you have of Canada?s perfection in regards to race and human rights. While America has a racist, hateful and violent past (and present), Canada too has blood on its hands, and acting as if it some perfect nation which is somehow more moral than any other country in the world is doing a great disservice to the actual history of it.

For instance, during WW2, the SS St. Louis sailed across the world filled with Jews looking for a country to give them a safe haven from the persecution they were facing back home. Cuba would not let them enter, Columbia, Argentina, Chile, Paraguay, America and CANADA would not let them enter either, saying they refused to give Jews an escape from their pending torture and death. The famous quote of a high ranking Canadian official regarding how many Jews they would let enter is ?zero is too many?. In this case, Canada was just as inhumane and hateful as many other nations, and watched as Jews were massacred.

Slavery too was not restricted to America. The French introduced slavery to Canada around the 1600s. And after the Revolutionary War in America, many slave owners took their slaves to Canada, but the rough weather did not produce crops slave owners were happy with and were forced to leave their slaves. Nova Scotia in particular was a hot bed for such activity.

Then you have the Anti-Oriental League and the Asiatic Exclusion League, aimed at removing all Asians from the land. Also, you have the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1885 which valued a Chinese ?head? at $50, and over 22 million dollars were collected in head tax payments. The 1923 Chinese Immigration Act completely restricted the Chinese from entering Canada. Similarly, the ?gentlemen?s agreement? with Japan in the early 1900s limited emigration of Japanese to Canada to 400 people/year.

And I don?t have to go into a thing about the treatment of Aboriginal people in Canada.

Point being, its great that we can discuss America?s hateful past, which I would be the last person to deny. But lets keep it funky and not gloss over Canada?s hateful past too.

 

[Summy]

haha what?!!. Alright okay let's evaluate this for one second. Lets look at the context in which Harman you made your point. Your post was so OBVIOUSLY google'd or very surfacely researched. Nobody is trying to claim Canada has a perfect race relations past, infact nobody brought up race relations in the first place. However, I know for a fact that Canadian history is rarely, to not at all taught in America, and if by a long shot you studied this on your own, your statements indicated a very superficial understanding of race relations in Canada. Kinda sounded like one of my posts, without...you know... the facts.

First off, it speaks VOLUMES about your argument when your criticism of race relations in Canada has to go back to 1923 for anything substanial. I go back 23 days and talk about America and their actions and you would have nothing to lean on. I want to say that although it may not matter to you, I have become increasingly disappointed with your posts recently. Im talking about cultural imperialism and you bring up canada's history, fine we will talk about those. Then it was the fight at auburn hills at its racist undertone. Your beginning to sound more like a guy looking for participation marks in your tutorials more than somebody who completely understands issues fully.

Slavery was NOT restricted to the states, your right, but it was popularized and legalized in the states, up till, ohhh lets say today. You dont realize that Nova Scotia was not part of the confederate when actions like that were prominent. You wouldnt know that because I doubt anyone here would know the name of the governor general of canada, let alone our independence and history. WWI and WWII had huge restrains of a Canadian army that suffered thorugh separtist talk in Quebec and the conscription crisis. Mckenzie King went against local and house demands when he included Canada on the front of Vimy Ridge and other battles in WWII. If you want to talk Canadian history, lets do it....


Funny thing about Harman's google understanding of Canadian history and slavery. Ask him when Canada legally outlawed slavery. Then search when America did.... Hey Harman, you remember that GOLORIOUS undergroudn railway that slaves would use? The railway that would led to a land that would be prosperious and massacare and ensalve people on the basis of their race? Guess where that Land was.... Guess where that railway would end up? Canada.

Canada began (under british rule may I remind you) freeing salves legally in the 1700's. The US was about 150 or so years late when it actually started to happen. The largest transfers of slaves in Canadian history range in the thousands, whereas the number of salves in the US where hundreds of times more.


I am not going to even ENTERTAIN the argument of Canada and United states and their race relations record. You are trying to claim that I believe Canada was perfect? NOT by a long shot buddy. Never would I say such a thing. But compared to America, you have NO right even to point one finger at Canada unless you have about a million point at yourself. The problem with americans is that they never look at themselves. This is why the world hates you guys. Your progressive northerns and youth, would be labelled at the most backward hillbillies in Canada. Its about time you guys have shame in your history and your current day actions, so maybe when you youth get in power, you realize the disgusting amounts of pain and horror you caused the world. You point the finger at Canada's shaky history? yes we do have one. But compared to you guys, we look like Mother Theresa. The amount of injustice we did in our HISTORY, the amount of racism, imperialistic past, prejudice legislation, suspending of rights, we have done in our HISTORY of our nation, you guys have managed to trump that in 3 years.


When educated, non prejeduice, non-nationalistic people talk about America and their contributions to the world, you, as an American have no right to point fingers at others, because if you want to get into a debate about even the magnitude of what America v Canada has put forth, I suggest you dont. I understand you thought that I was putting forth a wrong sense of purity in Canada and race relations, but even if I was, thats something you as an American should swallow.

Now, if you want to talk about America and their acts of imperialits be free to, because I think this info is valuable. The same way we think, what were those people in nazi germany thinking when they went through what they did, I am sure your grandkids will be asking you the same thing.

 

[HarmanSingh]

lol, I love how you act like your "approval" is the end all be all of everyone's lives. You are "dissapointed" in my posts? Great.

Did I say America's history is comparable to Canada's? Please, show me where that is the case. I even ended the post by saying America has and IS perpetuating hate here and across the world. I have been consistently admonishing America's history and am completely disgusted by it. Hell, look at my old posts where I straight up say I am not proud of America. I am not afraid to say it, and have no shame saying it to anyone. But you sit here and tell me I am akin to a hick who drapes himself in an American flag, waves the confederate flag and yells "USA! USA!"...right.

"if by a long shot you studied this on your own, your statements indicated a very superficial understanding of race relations in Canada. Kinda sounded like one of my posts, without...you know... the facts."...lol, I love how you just attack people for no reason. You tell me I googled this real fast and posted it. I know you have a tendency to act like you know everything about everyone who posts on here, but try and stay on the subject rather than telling me I don't read. And you assuming I have no knowledge of the underground railroad is funny, considering I live in Detroit, which is minutes away from Canada and was a hot spot for runaway slaves and the city offers underground railroad tours. So thank you, but I am plenty aware of the facts regarding the way slaves escaped. The post I wrote was real fast, and was probably very general. But I didn't feel the need to sit here and post an academic paper on Canada's history and its offenses against minority groups. You are right that it was very general, and I don't act as if I am an expert on Canadian history..but this is an informal forum. I don't need to sit here and cite sources, and give you detailed explanations of every point I am making.

I simply said Canada DOES have a history of slavery, a history of turning the other eye to the holocaust, of mistreating the aboriginal people and of perpetuating distrust and disgust towards Asian peoples. You dont deny this..you are just saying it happened a long time ago. So please don't act like Canada is the land of pure, wonderfully intelligent and highly moral people. It has a nasty history too, much like most countries. I swear, if anyone even brings up anythign to do with Canada you get a stiffy and rant about America's stupidity. Relax. Canada is just a piece of land. You don't need to make it seem like something greater than it is. If this a basketball game, both America and Canada lost. Sure, America lost by more...but you guys are takin a L just like us.

 

[pluthra]

American culture promotes the stripping of religiously, and cultural identity, and enacts a sense of superiority of one's own land, something distinctive to your land...

Now do u really think that America is stripping everyone religiously. Its not like we're forcing people to do so, and saying you can't be this- you have to be American and here learn these rules and throw a book at 'em and expect them to become Americans. There is a reason why the term "American" can't entirely be defined. If you go up to one person and ask them what an American is their answer will be different from the next, the next, the next. I understand the whole imperialistic actions America has taken, and wow I gotta say we are a stupid country at times...but its not like every country is perfect. Every country has to do what its gotta do to keep itself intact w/themselves.

And also, if we were forcing people to dissolve their religion, culture, etc then wouldn't we be committing genocide.....we were discussing genocide and the definition of it:

"any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: killing members of the group; causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life, calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; [and] forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."

Now, everyone knows of previous examples, but today in the world we live, I don't think we can say that the US is acting in such a malicious way. Or else, we'd have a lot of people on our backs-oh wait we already do.....but just wondering this study of US imperialism and comparing us to Nazis, is it done for the purpose of study, or for the purpose of making the US look bad? (i can't believe im defending the US)......but just in general doesn't every country seem to want to make another country look bad (what happened to if u can't talk good or even constructively then don't say anything at all-this is for countries), like everyone wants to trash on how this country did this----where's all the optimism in the news?

 

[Summy]

Harman,
Im glad you had a nice laugh buddy. I am not sure about the who losses thing. Although I am severely against some of the actions of the upper brass in Canada, as a country, they have been a champion of human rights and is recognized for it. From our foreign policy to our policies at home, we tend to be more progressive. Your claim that canada has a shaky past is something nobody disputed. The way you stated it, was general, and horribly misleading. If your posts were to prove Canada has a shakey history, congrats, you pointed out the tail on the donkey. But that didnt evaluate my post or come anything near to it. Anyways, for a good read, research some of the names I pointed out in my orginal post, and learn how America is employing tactics of cultural imperialism to justify their presence in countries who ideologies have always been different.
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Parul,

If you are asking me do I think the US is committting genocide, HELL YEAH. But the problem is that genocide is defined differently by different organizations. You may ask how... Everyone knows what is going on in Darfur right? Nearly 1/2 million people massacared, people being ethinically and religiously cleansed, the government sponsoring arab militia to attack innocent unarmed civilians. Preganant women being killed, and raped, babies being murdered. Everyone knows what is going on. Do you know the UN is reluctant to call it a genocide? Im pretty sure they still havent acknowledged it. They call it "genocidal acts"... Funny the same two words was uttered by the Iraqi embassador to the UN about the actions of the US in their land.

Lets just look at the Iraq war, forget everything else, like the US's hand in international oil, their part in Darfur, etc.... Nationally Iraqi is in ruins. Ethnic and religious group wars. A civil war that is happening. I can go on about the acts of the US all over the world, the fact of the matter is, what the US is doing is not that different from what the Nazis did.

WHat is being asserted is the act of manipulation. The fact that the Nazis argued that dictatorship and typed of armed and trained people that is necessary. IN a country that hasnt lived in democratic rules, for better or worse, the US is pushing an idea of democracy, and democratic theory to an engrained people who havent lived that way, and whose cultural traditions may not mesh with those notions. Who is the US to say that democracy needs to happen in the middle east. An influx of American culture has hit Iraq. The fact that they are "Educating" women on what they believe is patarichal practices such as the full body hijab.

The Nazis exported a culture or rightness on the world. The countries they invaded and were present in were victim to this type of export of rightness and wrongness. Cultural practices were exported. Theory was exported. They use physical force, and political power for the purpose of cultural manipulation.

Its hard for those who live in the present to understand the overall atrocity of the events, but your grandkids will look back to the contributing or the acts of genocide your country has committed not just in the last 8 years, but decades before that, and it is argued that the United States can be placed amongst the worst imperialists the world has ever seen.

I guess when you live in the centre of the storm, everything seems so normal. BUt as an outsider, I cant even begin to tell you about the disgust and severity of the actions of your country. It is important for the youth to understand it, because hopefully a country that will be 60% of immigrant decents in 15 years will have an appreciation for independent nations and cultures and their sovergnity