Arjun Barua
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Hand of Godard said:
Wow, 10 points can be gotten through "Originality and/or Traditionality"... ??? Anyone else confused?
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- Thread starter Hand of Godard
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Wow, 10 points can be gotten through "Originality and/or Traditionality"... ??? Anyone else confused?
Hand of Godard
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True, we played a part in judge selection. Still, IPS may want to re-examine the necessity for media, industry and certainly non-bhangra judges. Another thing could be to inform captains and choreos ahead of time who they're thinking of nominating as judges so that teams can then do their research, and if necessary propose alternatives in some sort of forum during the buildup to the actual meeting. As it was, I know I certainly had no clue what were the credentials of the options presented and had to rely on IPS' testimony.Jas13 said:
Hand of Godard
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I can't recall the exact reasoning behind the wording. But the captains/choreos were responsible for it.BRRUAH! said:
Hand of Godard
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Good stuff, Jas. We were playing it and Leicester's mix (via Youtube) over and over on Friday night.Jas13 said:
faysal
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how does originality go with traditionality :s and if anything there were a few teams who were very unoriginal choreo wise not that the judges probably noticed this. That is def one part of the rubric that looks like it needs re-wording or re-establishing altogether. J
Jas mate if you made that soorma mix then +1 and send and if you didn't...then umm send still? lol
Jas mate if you made that soorma mix then +1 and send and if you didn't...then umm send still? lol
Hi,
I'm one of the organisers of the show. I'd like to touch on a few details mentioned here without going into a discussion, but raise some important issues. Firstly I'd like to congratulate Birmingham on a great performance.
I'd also like to thank all those who have supported the committee and competing teams thus far. Remember the show is young and every year we are taking giant leaps. This year myself and my co-president have worked day and night to iron out many issues and have made, as described by all, a massive leap in correcting the issues raised on this forum that arose from last year's competition.
1. The markscheme is criticised about how many points are given to different categories. As Jas correctly mentioned, the choreos of the 10 competing teams decided the marskcheme subsections and points down to the finest detail with no input from the organisers. I’d like to thank the choreos for taking the time to go through this at the meetings.
2. The Judges were also done in the same way. In a post TBS 2010 meeting, the 7 teams of last year decided to move towards 5 diverse judges as listed above. We then gave nominations for each category and offered all choreos to put forward nominations however most didn't take up this opportunity. The nominations were voted on by the 10 competing teams again with no input from the organisers, along with the option of re-opening nominations. The 5 diverse judges was an idea of a competing team choreo and agreed upon by all at the meeting so as to appreciate the different aspects of Bhangra the teams bring to the stage. To then disagree with 1st place being traditional and 2nd place being modern goes against this logic. Once again, a huge thanks to all those that co-operated in this process.
3. Organising such a large event in the UK differs hugely from the US. It’s disappointing to see some of those closely involved in the show putting down specific aspects of the show. The venues have tight restrictions, forcing upon us the idea of teams in coaches at the last minute due to the sheer number of performers. Furthermore, teams did in fact complain about being able to watch the show since it gave an unfair advantage to those who didn't have to go through the nerve-racking experience of seeing the teams first on stage. Everything here was therefore fair and done due to necessity, despite costing us in the thousands. Our prime concern is caring for the teams, hence the lengthy meetings, thousands spent on meeting their requirements and deep consideration for all their issues, however such restrictions give us no option in certain circumstances.
4. As mentioned, this is the only competition in the UK. Restricting how teams can perform Bhangra on stage (traditional or modern) reduces the entertainment factor to the UK audience which differs to that from the US audience. Whilst I do agree diversity is possible with traditionality, who are we to force upon a team about what to include in their dance. The team choreos decided as a unit to move in the mixed traditional/modern direction for the judges and markschemes for TBS 2011. As mentioned maybe there is scope for change here. We are open to anything the choreos bring to the table in the meetings as long as all are happy with the final decision.
I hope I have covered most of the issues brought up. It is disappointing to see people go against the running of the show despite being so closely involved. I would like to thank all those involved who have supported the teams and committee. It is not only our hard work, but that of the teams that has made the show successful, many of whom have been a delight to work with. Should any performers wish to raise any issues, we are more than happy to discuss it with them personally. Thanks to everyone that has posted constructive criticism, that's exactly what we like to take on board and will work towards making it bigger and better!
Thank you for taking the time to read the long message.
I'm one of the organisers of the show. I'd like to touch on a few details mentioned here without going into a discussion, but raise some important issues. Firstly I'd like to congratulate Birmingham on a great performance.
I'd also like to thank all those who have supported the committee and competing teams thus far. Remember the show is young and every year we are taking giant leaps. This year myself and my co-president have worked day and night to iron out many issues and have made, as described by all, a massive leap in correcting the issues raised on this forum that arose from last year's competition.
1. The markscheme is criticised about how many points are given to different categories. As Jas correctly mentioned, the choreos of the 10 competing teams decided the marskcheme subsections and points down to the finest detail with no input from the organisers. I’d like to thank the choreos for taking the time to go through this at the meetings.
2. The Judges were also done in the same way. In a post TBS 2010 meeting, the 7 teams of last year decided to move towards 5 diverse judges as listed above. We then gave nominations for each category and offered all choreos to put forward nominations however most didn't take up this opportunity. The nominations were voted on by the 10 competing teams again with no input from the organisers, along with the option of re-opening nominations. The 5 diverse judges was an idea of a competing team choreo and agreed upon by all at the meeting so as to appreciate the different aspects of Bhangra the teams bring to the stage. To then disagree with 1st place being traditional and 2nd place being modern goes against this logic. Once again, a huge thanks to all those that co-operated in this process.
3. Organising such a large event in the UK differs hugely from the US. It’s disappointing to see some of those closely involved in the show putting down specific aspects of the show. The venues have tight restrictions, forcing upon us the idea of teams in coaches at the last minute due to the sheer number of performers. Furthermore, teams did in fact complain about being able to watch the show since it gave an unfair advantage to those who didn't have to go through the nerve-racking experience of seeing the teams first on stage. Everything here was therefore fair and done due to necessity, despite costing us in the thousands. Our prime concern is caring for the teams, hence the lengthy meetings, thousands spent on meeting their requirements and deep consideration for all their issues, however such restrictions give us no option in certain circumstances.
4. As mentioned, this is the only competition in the UK. Restricting how teams can perform Bhangra on stage (traditional or modern) reduces the entertainment factor to the UK audience which differs to that from the US audience. Whilst I do agree diversity is possible with traditionality, who are we to force upon a team about what to include in their dance. The team choreos decided as a unit to move in the mixed traditional/modern direction for the judges and markschemes for TBS 2011. As mentioned maybe there is scope for change here. We are open to anything the choreos bring to the table in the meetings as long as all are happy with the final decision.
I hope I have covered most of the issues brought up. It is disappointing to see people go against the running of the show despite being so closely involved. I would like to thank all those involved who have supported the teams and committee. It is not only our hard work, but that of the teams that has made the show successful, many of whom have been a delight to work with. Should any performers wish to raise any issues, we are more than happy to discuss it with them personally. Thanks to everyone that has posted constructive criticism, that's exactly what we like to take on board and will work towards making it bigger and better!
Thank you for taking the time to read the long message.
naujawanidotcom
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R.E.S.P.E.C.T to Imperial College Punjabi soc for responding on these boards! As has been mentioned previously by more than one user (including this one!), it's obvious you would read this thread and take constructive feedback on board. Well done for taking it to the next level and replying on the boards to alleviate concerns of individuals 
... the UK takeover(!) of BTF continues
I'm sure competing team members appreciate the clarification of judges/mark-scheme selection and will continue that conversation.
Touching on what you say about the traditionality/modernity of TBS, I think it is even more obvious now that the UK needs more competitions, but as is evident on these boards, such will only emerge with time and a committed group of individuals such as those at Imperial. Well done for posting again!
... the UK takeover(!) of BTF continues I'm sure competing team members appreciate the clarification of judges/mark-scheme selection and will continue that conversation.
Touching on what you say about the traditionality/modernity of TBS, I think it is even more obvious now that the UK needs more competitions, but as is evident on these boards, such will only emerge with time and a committed group of individuals such as those at Imperial. Well done for posting again!
Hand of Godard
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For clarification, were the nominees made known prior to the meeting in November? My team wasn’t exactly filled with the greatest communicators so it’s possible that they were known.ICPS said:
If they weren’t, as I suggested above, it might be better
I’m sorry, but this doesn’t explicitly address what the “restrictions” were. If they were, as I’ve been told, about exceeding the building’s maximum capacity, then surely ICPS did have an option which was to not sell off tickets for seats which could have been allocated to us. Sounds like it would have been a better business decision as well if the thousands in costs incurred from bus rental really did exceed the revenue generated from ticket sales.ICPS said:
Also, it is disappointing that some teams’ complaints (when did this take place?) would have moved you to make such a decision. You’ve demonstrated your desire to involve teams in the decision-making process. Why not consult all of us before taking such action? If some couldn’t handle the pressure of watching others perform, why punish those who thrive in such situations?
EDIT: I'm sure you guys did what you thought was best. It didn't make everyone happy. I've said my piece, and I'm going to drop it now.
Hi,
Again not to go into a discussion, but I'm happy to quickly cover some of the points brought up.
As a committee this year we’ve followed everything that the teams have put forward wherever feasible. A competing team from 2010 can vouch for the lengths we have gone to ensure we take these opinions on board.
In terms of the Judges, in the post TBS 2010 meeting, the decision was made as to how the nominees would work. No choreos then disagreed with how it was to be run. If they had wished to know the nominees before the vote it would have been discussed. Each choreo was reminded several times about their opportunity to put forward nominations, of which a small minority followed up on. I appreciate the suggestion, if this is something teams wish for next year, it is a point that can be brought up in the next choreos meeting so the decisions we made as a group can improve.
As I mentioned, it’s tough to see how a venue works until you’re in the thick of it. Up to now, performers have never had the chance to watch the show due to the way things work out. As choreos know, the initial plan this year was to seat performers at the back so they could watch the show. A sell out capacity at such a venue differed hugely to one which would be half full in the venue's minds of how the backstage was run. Once we sold out, such venues are not happy to have their reputation affected by large numbers of performers walking through their full audiences. This is understandable. Our initial solution was a marquee, however wasn’t possible with the venue due to health and safety. As a result we were forced to go ahead with coaches. We strived to ensure the teams weren’t affected too much and paid for a single coach for each team. In fact, our home team, Imperial, were affected the most by this since they were seated for the longest.
Some teams expressing their opinions about not wanting to watch the first half had no affect on the coaches since we simply had no option. Pretty much every team understood the difficult situation we were in. If we did have an option, we would have gone through it thoroughly as we have done so with everything else to come to a common decision. Again, despite the financial downside, we simply had no option and I’d like to thank all those who have been so understanding with the situation and appreciate the lengths we went through to accommodate for each teams requests.
I hope all points raised for improvement can be accepted towards being a joint decision so we can move on to a bigger and better show in 2012.
Again not to go into a discussion, but I'm happy to quickly cover some of the points brought up.
As a committee this year we’ve followed everything that the teams have put forward wherever feasible. A competing team from 2010 can vouch for the lengths we have gone to ensure we take these opinions on board.
In terms of the Judges, in the post TBS 2010 meeting, the decision was made as to how the nominees would work. No choreos then disagreed with how it was to be run. If they had wished to know the nominees before the vote it would have been discussed. Each choreo was reminded several times about their opportunity to put forward nominations, of which a small minority followed up on. I appreciate the suggestion, if this is something teams wish for next year, it is a point that can be brought up in the next choreos meeting so the decisions we made as a group can improve.
As I mentioned, it’s tough to see how a venue works until you’re in the thick of it. Up to now, performers have never had the chance to watch the show due to the way things work out. As choreos know, the initial plan this year was to seat performers at the back so they could watch the show. A sell out capacity at such a venue differed hugely to one which would be half full in the venue's minds of how the backstage was run. Once we sold out, such venues are not happy to have their reputation affected by large numbers of performers walking through their full audiences. This is understandable. Our initial solution was a marquee, however wasn’t possible with the venue due to health and safety. As a result we were forced to go ahead with coaches. We strived to ensure the teams weren’t affected too much and paid for a single coach for each team. In fact, our home team, Imperial, were affected the most by this since they were seated for the longest.
Some teams expressing their opinions about not wanting to watch the first half had no affect on the coaches since we simply had no option. Pretty much every team understood the difficult situation we were in. If we did have an option, we would have gone through it thoroughly as we have done so with everything else to come to a common decision. Again, despite the financial downside, we simply had no option and I’d like to thank all those who have been so understanding with the situation and appreciate the lengths we went through to accommodate for each teams requests.
I hope all points raised for improvement can be accepted towards being a joint decision so we can move on to a bigger and better show in 2012.
Kamal_Dhaliwal
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Keep up the good works guys, a lot of improvement!
Competition needs a lot of refurbishing. There are loads of people from North America in UK who can be consulted in this regard and can help this competition goto another level. I know for a fact there are at least 2 North Americans in Leicester (Vic from SGPD and Rob V), I heard at least 1 North American on Birmingham and and a few in London on different teams. So why not get these people to sit down and help setup the competition from their experiences.
I've heard it been stated on this thread "this isn't North America" so then why try to copy north america competitions and north american bhangra, create your own shit and stop bitching then.
Either way, major improvement from the videos and an evolution of bhangra in UK.
I've heard it been stated on this thread "this isn't North America" so then why try to copy north america competitions and north american bhangra, create your own shit and stop bitching then.
Either way, major improvement from the videos and an evolution of bhangra in UK.