How to make amazing bhangra mixes without saturating with effects n hip hop

[J Wong]

I think what this all sums up to is to not let gimmicks and hip hop amount to over 50% of the mix. A less is more sort of thing. BTW, great job at Bruin.

 

[faizan]

folk. folk. folk. folk. folk.


hardeep, what year are those videos from? Oh, that's right...2006 and 2007. No one forgot, we just moved on.


From 1970-2000 bhangra on a stage, was nowhere. If you compare a LIVE team from then to a LIVE team from now, they would look like amateurs. The beautiful folk teams you see in India and North America, are so beautiful and folk because they have gotten better. Watch an old school Surrey India Arts Club video, from like, 2004 or 5, and compare it to the team and dancers now or watch and old Nanak Dev video and watch one from now, BET you like the new ones better. (I'm sure you guys have hardons for videos from like 1983 that you found in your basement on a VHS, but you know what I mean.) The reason why the teams look better now is because it just looks cleaner, more crisp, more nakhra, more form, more "proper." Have you ever seen jugni from like 20 years ago? These moves, in the last 15 years or so have been honed and perfected. (Bhangra began in 1947 and was not on stage in the sense you see it today until like the 1960s.) With that, it has changed and new elements have been added.


The North American "modern" bhangra scene speaks for itself in regards to transformation and improvement. But, now bhangra in North America is at its new stage, the new frontier, the new "perfect." The old stuff was good, but the new stuff is better. The teams that do the best, are the teams that do everything you guys detest. And they keep it folk and sexy. And as I have seen this season (which was a disappointment), teams don't know how, when or if, they should take the next step, but they will, otherwise, they will become relics. They will be snickerd at behind closed doors. Called "corny, modern, etc...etc..." It's evolving, and it's survival of the fittest. I think we are in a mass extinction, and teams are going to get cut. But I see rebirth and growth coming from, where else, canada. America will lag, as it always has. I don't see next season being much more interesting. The reconstruction will take time. I think Elite 8 has an important role to play, they must, as they did in their first year, take that step, and make a statement as to where the NORTH AMERICAN bhangra scene stands, right here, right now, and it has to be honest, because teams have been swagger jacking NJ and SGPD from their FIRST Elite performances and forgot to at least copy their new shit.


As far as music goes, I agree, older music sounded better. Old is gold. We all grew up with a certain type of old school music played in our homes, no matter what those songs are. We attach nostalgia to them, we guard their authenticity and swear by them. Whether it's biggie, mohammad rafi, or chamkila. I respect that place, and I won't be the one to sully its importance. But you think that when your parents were listening to chamkila in their pinds, that their parents liked it? PPSSHHHH, chamkila was elvis, he talked some dirty controversial shit, they would spit on him. 200 years ago in punjab, they would spit on our grandparents' music, and shit on our music. But that's just the way it goes...but you guys don't need to hold on to that old stuff so militantly, it's ok to be the 2011 version of folk. Because you will never be folk enough, because there is always someone older who thinks your a modern idiot. India is different, what is going on there has nothing to do with what I am saying about OUR music as second generation south-asians. Desis for the most part, no matter what part of america they are in, gravitate to hip hop. Show me one desi kid who diddn't have a "black" stage. Show me one desi kid who did not hear "old indian" music in their house growing up. You don't think that desi kid, when he joins a bhangra team, won't throw em together? It's amazing that desi kids can put them together, and still do folk bhangra, and love it. It's a beautiful thing, and it's who we are.


But, Hardeep, you need to get that the idea of a "smooth hip-hop-less" mix out of your head. Those mixes if used today would be laughed off the stage. The techonology and knowledge of mixers back then could never dream of what we do now. Listen to sher and kj's mixes, they got SIX FOOT SEVEN from lil wayne, the epitome of a hip hop mix type of song. KJ knows, and they built this shit. AEG's mixes used to have like 7 sound effects, but now we dance and entire segment to the theme song from the jersey shore. We have also mixed chamkila, babbu mann, surjit bindrakhia, gurdass mann, kuldip manak and surinder shinda into our mixes. We know what folk is...but we also know it's time to make folk suit OUR GENERATION. Show me an Elite 8 team who diddn't mix bhangra and hip hop, show me one that did an ALL-folk and won. The lineups from Elite 8, Bruin, THESE are OUR GENERATION'S best teams. Live has its place, but it certainly does not represent OUR generation. Unless you are straight from India and just did not grow up here.


All those throw backs, all the good old days, the folk till i die thing--no doubt, i feel you...but to suggest that those things either should return, remain untouched, or increased illustrates a misunderstanding of TODAY'S BHANGRA.


But if you don't have an opinion and you just love your folk! That's cool, i'm not trying to pick fights, because i know some of you are salivating at this response your typing right now. Relax, step back, and realize...What I am saying is that THS is the way it's gonna be, and the kids who dance today, will think the kids who danced in 20 years are so modern and that THEY THEMSELVES were folk. SGPD's kids will think that SGPD as masti 2009 was folk, and probably won't even remember Gabroo Shokeen or PPA, even though WE think they are folk NOW. I'm not calling people out, I'm just calling this as I see it, watching bhangra change from when I started in 2001 and now, in 2011.


but Hardeep, on that mix thing, it's not happening bro, not because I'm a dick and I'm wrong, but because...it's just not happening. Let it go guys, the hip hop stuff is us, and the old stuff, is us too.

 

[bballkid2592]

I think what this all sums up to is to not let gimmicks and hip hop amount to over 50% of the mix. A less is more sort of thing. BTW, great job at Bruin.

there is no need to set a percentage bro...teams themselves should know to win most competitions..you still need to remain somewhat folk.


Don't worry too much...people in North American won't let bhangra become a hiphop/fusion dance.

 

[Psant]

Idealistic. It's too mainstream now to do anything about; you'll only see it in the live category of competitions if they even have one.

 

[hardeep_singh]

folk. folk. folk. folk. folk.

………………………………………………………………..

but Hardeep, on that mix thing, it's not happening bro, not because I'm a dick and I'm wrong, but because...it's just not happening. Let it go guys, the hip hop stuff is us, and the old stuff, is us too.

ya i went through a "black" phase in middle school but i grew out of it and i've never looked back. the only music ever played in my house was kirtan so when i started listening to folk Punjabi music, i had no prior exposure or any reason to actually like it, but the more i've listened to it, the more i love it. i agree that music and dance has to evolve overtime but I disagree with your statements implying that it is necessary to have a lot of effects and hip hop to be competitive; I see the emphasis on effects and hip hop as a current fad/phase. My personal opinion is that this fad has been played out at this point, I can’t make any assumptions about where bhangra mixes will be 3 yrs down the road but I think people need to start exploring other avenues. that’s the cool thing about evolution, there’s always a variety of different paths you can take. We’re only limiting ourselves by emulating trends created by others, plus it just leads to a lot of homogeneity. I’m not gonna deny my love for live/folk performances, yes my knowledge of the history of bhangra and even modern bhangra is severely limited but it’s tough to describe the enjoyment I get from seeing a good live performance. It’s just raw and beautiful watching a team dance to dhol, dhad, tumbi, sarangi, and a good singer. Dil khush ho janda eda di performance dekh ke. You’re right things have to change but it’s everyones responsibility to guide that change and ensure that you don’t completely disconnect from the roots. Thanks for the input.

 

[jaz89]

folk. folk. folk. folk. folk.

………………………………………………………………..

but Hardeep, on that mix thing, it's not happening bro, not because I'm a dick and I'm wrong, but because...it's just not happening. Let it go guys, the hip hop stuff is us, and the old stuff, is us too.

ya i went through a "black" phase in middle school but i grew out of it and i've never looked back. the only music ever played in my house was kirtan so when i started listening to folk Punjabi music, i had no prior exposure or any reason to actually like it, but the more i've listened to it, the more i love it. i agree that music and dance has to evolve overtime but I disagree with your statements implying that it is necessary to have a lot of effects and hip hop to be competitive; I see the emphasis on effects and hip hop as a current fad/phase. My personal opinion is that this fad has been played out at this point, I can’t make any assumptions about where bhangra mixes will be 3 yrs down the road but I think people need to start exploring other avenues. that’s the cool thing about evolution, there’s always a variety of different paths you can take. We’re only limiting ourselves by emulating trends created by others, plus it just leads to a lot of homogeneity. I’m not gonna deny my love for live/folk performances, yes my knowledge of the history of bhangra and even modern bhangra is severely limited but it’s tough to describe the enjoyment I get from seeing a good live performance. It’s just raw and beautiful watching a team dance to dhol, dhad, tumbi, sarangi, and a good singer. Dil khush ho janda eda di performance dekh ke. You’re right things have to change but it’s everyones responsibility to guide that change and ensure that you don’t completely disconnect from the roots. Thanks for the input.

+ 1. even i like listening to the hip hop beats fused with bhangra SOMETIMES but i just think it's been overdone to death. It just for me takes away the authenticity of the whole dance to some degree. It feels so refreshing and good to watch something like this after hearing the OTT remixing, "ching" sounds, and Lil wayne beats: Virse De Waris & Heeray Punjab De @ Bruin Bhangra 2011. Watching this feels like a breath of fresh air!

 

[campy614]

Its about time that people start realizing that Bhangra isn't about gimmicks and hip hop mixes, its about traditional form and execution which presently has deviated from its original state greatly.

Homo Erectus would have agreed with you. Wait, oh yeah... that thing called evolution...

Dear Sue, 143.

I got an idea!! Let's take the 1000x's argued and beaten to f*king death 'traditional vs. modern' argument, paint it beat red with white stripes, and revamp... only we'll talk about it "solely" in terms of mixing. Is this really all necessary!?!?!? I love live too, but let teams do what they want. You don't like a team's style, then hit the X at the top right corner.

PS Faizan, Mow, Navi, Faroghe, and I have a good friend in India who used to laugh his ass off every time you'd say the words "Homo Erectus"... it was hilarious. I miss him mannnnn

 

[HarmanSingh]

Hardeep- doesn't PANJ use hip hop beats and stuff? If your own team isn't living up to the "standard" you have set why would you expect other teams to?

 

[hardeep_singh]

Hardeep- doesn't PANJ use hip hop beats and stuff? If your own team isn't living up to the "standard" you have set why would you expect other teams to?

lol i'm friends with 1 of the founders, maybe one day i might have a chance to dance with em if i get good enough and they do an east coast comp, but ya i'm not actually on panj

with respect to the point that you're trying to make, yes i've danced with teams on mixes which used hip hop beats and other funky stuff (...duck sauce - barbara streisand) and most of the time i either get ignored for voicing my opinion on the matter or bitched at for not being cool with it. i've given up on trying to change people's minds it just creates tension in most situations, too much of the "this song is cool and we're using it no matter what you think"

 

[mafzal]

I think the initial comment on this was a yearning for was more mixes where the Punjabi music isn't drowned out by lil wayne's bass. Hip hop is a great in a mix, but it's best when balanced out with dhol, nice subtle effects, make sure the punjabi vocal is loud enough, etc.

Harman Toor and Gsimz in particular do a good job with this. If you listen carefully they delicately lay in a lot of simple sounds, loops, and beats that really add to and emphasize the original songs rather than relying on hip hop to completely carry the mix.

Note that this does take a lot more time, talent, and skill than just mashing up songs and beats. Not everyone has the talent and dedication, or the resources to get them...

 

[Maheep]

I think the initial comment on this was a yearning for was more mixes where the Punjabi music isn't drowned out by lil wayne's bass. Hip hop is a great in a mix, but it's best when balanced out with dhol, nice subtle effects, make sure the punjabi vocal is loud enough, etc.

Harman Toor and Gsimz in particular do a good job with this. If you listen carefully they delicately lay in a lot of simple sounds, loops, and beats that really add to and emphasize the original songs rather than relying on hip hop to completely carry the mix.

Note that this does take a lot more time, talent, and skill than just mashing up songs and beats. Not everyone has the talent and dedication, or the resources to get them...

what she said
im a noob at mixing only cause i started but ive been playin a lil bit of dhol and a lot of tabla (not kirtan just classical w/o any1 else)
but what playing an instrument taught me was that u can do pretty much whatever you want as long as you can do properly
you can make up ur own bol (dha ghe trikit dha dha tirkit ...)
but you also have to know where they can be used and if u feel like abusing the shit out of it well then learn a lot so you can put it into different taals
Basically mix like harman toor and 2nyce and gsimz and dont be a retard

 

[Billy Bob]

The bhangra scene for the past 6 years has been about fads. It seems like every season or couple of seasons, we go through a new fad. Things are changing and developing, yeah I agree hip hop is being overused and i'm sure if you let it take its natural path, people will eventually stop using it so much because it will get old. It may already be old to us but thats because we're all about bhangra. Not everyone else is.

If we want to continue to spread bhangra we have to appeal to those who are watching. Get more people to come to more competitions. Frankly, traditional bhangra does not cut it for most people, they sit through a few hour show of what seems to them is the same shit over and over again. Unless we are innovative and appeal to a larger mass, we are going to hit a brick wall in spreading bhangra and keeping it popular.

its great that we still have some competitions that are more traditional and some that are more modern so it seems like there's a venue for everyone's taste. People are going to continue to innovate as the need arises. Once they see people bored of the same shit, they are going to come out with something new.

We all do it for the love of bhangra at the end of the day, though it may not be as true to its original form as it once was. At its core, its still bhangra and the intent is the same.

 

[hardeep_singh]

The bhangra scene for the past 6 years has been about fads. It seems like every season or couple of seasons, we go through a new fad.

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