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What do YOU think of taxes?
- Thread starter pluthra
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pluthra
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Saleem!!!!!!!!!! do i have to make the topic any clearer!!!! I said "What do YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUU think of taxes? not what does McCain or Obama think!!!!!
me....taxes are great (1) helps fund programs-even though some of those programs are so unnecessary; (2) provides jobs (ex. tax season-cash it in)
me....taxes are great (1) helps fund programs-even though some of those programs are so unnecessary; (2) provides jobs (ex. tax season-cash it in)
Jabar Jung
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pretty stupid because instead of getting that money YOU earned, goes to people who are lazy and stupid and drug addict and rande...saale...
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I love that taxes fund key programs that help make America educated (public schools/colleges) and at the cutting edge (e.g., NASA). However if you look at where every $100 goes, you'll see between $30-50 goes to Defense and the Military Industrial Complex in America. That is, to War. And it's really regrettable, as so much more can be done with that money to make a sustainable economy, energy independence, eliminating hunger, science research, etc.
potentially biased:
less biased:
10% of the entire budget is just interest on our debts. Is that how you'd spend your paycheck, is that wise?? $406,000,000,000 ($406B) was spent on interest. Compare with $15B on NASA.
I think taxes are a necessary evil (EVEN THOUGH the income tax wasn't introduced until the 20th century!!!), but the spending in America is so disproportionate to our needs and full of pork-barrel spending, that we really need an overhaul. An overhaul that, sadly, not even Obama can bring (although I do support his efforts). The only candidate that would have really changed the budget and scope of America was the only true, fiscal conservative, true Republican, Ron Paul. That guy woulda started chopping programs from Day 1, including the IRS haha. Quite a thinker, congressman Paul knows his stuff.
potentially biased:
less biased:
10% of the entire budget is just interest on our debts. Is that how you'd spend your paycheck, is that wise?? $406,000,000,000 ($406B) was spent on interest. Compare with $15B on NASA.
I think taxes are a necessary evil (EVEN THOUGH the income tax wasn't introduced until the 20th century!!!), but the spending in America is so disproportionate to our needs and full of pork-barrel spending, that we really need an overhaul. An overhaul that, sadly, not even Obama can bring (although I do support his efforts). The only candidate that would have really changed the budget and scope of America was the only true, fiscal conservative, true Republican, Ron Paul. That guy woulda started chopping programs from Day 1, including the IRS haha. Quite a thinker, congressman Paul knows his stuff.
Jeeti
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Taxes are a necessary evil BUT this country is a very classic capitalistic country and the big problem lies with the upper middle class to higher class. The notion of those incredibly succesful people to have to give a much higher percentage tax, which by the way Obama is going to inevitably raise...is not fair for those that believe the classic indian hard work ethic of...LISTEN, IF I CAN COME INTO THIS COUNTRY WITH THIS MUCH IN MY POCKET, SO ON AND SO FORTH....this battle will continue...I am rather torn..Obama's SUPER speeches and fresh face are rather appealing, but don't be fooled...the man will raise taxes like theres no tomorrow....Saleem said:
so what do I think about taxes?
I take a very conservative/republican view...someone being taxed higher because of their own hard work and their own success makes absolutely no sense. If we are a strictly capitalistic country, then there should be no individual tax brackets..
call me cynical...my view will cause much debate I'm sure...but this is a debate that is not often brought to light....many americans think that taxes are taxes are taxes which is not necessarily true...obviously, I am sure many will jump on the soap box and begin to rant....but if we are to be considered capitalists...capitalists are selfish....who is to say that if one was able to earn more money than the next person that they should have to give more of it back?
Summy
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Taxes are necessary and useful when done right. America, does not do it right. I find it surprsing that Americans complain about their taxes, and Canadians do less, when on each dollar Canadians pay 15% (i think its down to 13-14 now). So on each dollar, we pay 15 cents. Thats a lot.
But Canadians also never have to worry about healthcare. Whatever surgery you need, if you cough, you can see the doctor regardless of your income bracket, and regardless of your finicial situation/ insurance situation.
If you live in a society, and you use the societies resources, taxes need to be high. If a country is protecting you from foriegn problems, it will cost you. However, taxes are also a way from politicans to hide their policy they make with interest of special interest groups. TO keep things consistent, the pharma companies own washington, which consequently owns you, in everyday life.
"pretty stupid because instead of getting that money YOU earned, goes to people who are lazy and stupid and drug addict and rande...saale..."
That is probably the most ignorant statement I have heard in a while. THOSE LAZY people a) are part of your society, and secondly, can be you one day. Your one lay-off, one tragedy, one CAR accident, away from you being one of those people. Some people arent lazy, some people are disabled, and its a community, and you have an obligation to take of those people. Putta nahi, tu apna aap nu kee samaaj da paa, par gaal iddha jee, ke jai (god forbid) parmatma ne mapaay laagay, tu vee idha ho sugdaa veeray.
Jeeti, rich white america, firstly, is mostly old money. Its not their money, but their grandparents money, in a lot of cases. As a community, these rich americans benefit immensely, from the run of the mill society. Be them software billionaires, phara exec's, buisness exec's, each and every one of these people make money off of the people. There is kind of a duty for those people to who make absurds amount of money off of these people, to support them, so they can continue to make money off of them.
Also, societies are communal. If it was about making your own money, and supporting you own self, why expect national defense, build your own raods, educate your own doctors. THere is a huge reason why you MUST tax the rich, regardless of how they made their own money. Your hard work means nothing without the community you benefit from.
Canadians have a beautiful tax system. Tax everyone the same, tax rich people on their income once a month. Not saying the political system is great, but Canada, Europe, and the UK have tax system that are crucial to the betterment of the society and the way of life.
But Canadians also never have to worry about healthcare. Whatever surgery you need, if you cough, you can see the doctor regardless of your income bracket, and regardless of your finicial situation/ insurance situation.
If you live in a society, and you use the societies resources, taxes need to be high. If a country is protecting you from foriegn problems, it will cost you. However, taxes are also a way from politicans to hide their policy they make with interest of special interest groups. TO keep things consistent, the pharma companies own washington, which consequently owns you, in everyday life.
"pretty stupid because instead of getting that money YOU earned, goes to people who are lazy and stupid and drug addict and rande...saale..."
That is probably the most ignorant statement I have heard in a while. THOSE LAZY people a) are part of your society, and secondly, can be you one day. Your one lay-off, one tragedy, one CAR accident, away from you being one of those people. Some people arent lazy, some people are disabled, and its a community, and you have an obligation to take of those people. Putta nahi, tu apna aap nu kee samaaj da paa, par gaal iddha jee, ke jai (god forbid) parmatma ne mapaay laagay, tu vee idha ho sugdaa veeray.
Jeeti, rich white america, firstly, is mostly old money. Its not their money, but their grandparents money, in a lot of cases. As a community, these rich americans benefit immensely, from the run of the mill society. Be them software billionaires, phara exec's, buisness exec's, each and every one of these people make money off of the people. There is kind of a duty for those people to who make absurds amount of money off of these people, to support them, so they can continue to make money off of them.
Also, societies are communal. If it was about making your own money, and supporting you own self, why expect national defense, build your own raods, educate your own doctors. THere is a huge reason why you MUST tax the rich, regardless of how they made their own money. Your hard work means nothing without the community you benefit from.
Canadians have a beautiful tax system. Tax everyone the same, tax rich people on their income once a month. Not saying the political system is great, but Canada, Europe, and the UK have tax system that are crucial to the betterment of the society and the way of life.
Summy
New Member
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Saleem, income taxes are different from how much you get taxed each purchase. Your talking about income tax that you file once a year, and that is dependent on so many things, it is also higher in canada. I am talking about on each and every purchase, from a choclate bar, to a car, to pay 13% (updated figure just recently changed) on that purchase in taxes (5% to government, and 8% to your province). Difference between income tax, and your everyday purchase tax.
Varun,
Canada's health system is constantly ranked amongst the best in the planet (source: maclean, canada's TIME magaznie, can be given upon request). The wait times is a criticism that is somewhat valid, but defintely exaggerated.
First off, in Canada, it doesnt matter how much money you have. You cant pay for better, or worst health care, as per the Canada Health Act. So you can be a billionaire, or you can be a a mother of 5 on wealthfare, you wait in the same lines, to see the same physicians, and recieve the same care. So, the benefit of universal free healthcare, like in Canada, like in Eurpoe is that everyone recieves the same care, and everyone recieves care necessary. It is not dependent on your pocket book.
Your not feeling well, or you see a bump that you want to get checked out, go to your family doctor, who depending on the doc, with appointment you can see in less than 10 minutes. He can refer you anything, xrays, biopsy's, MRI's, surgery whatever, you never have to contact your insurance company, nothing gets sent to your house regarding the operation, you go there do your thing and leave, everything is taken care of. It provides a more healthier country, a more beneficial work force.
The waiting times depends on where you live. If you live in Toronto, it will take you longer. An emerg visit depending on the time of day can go from 30 mins- 3 +hours. They prioritize your visit. So if you come in with chest pains and low vitals, they are admit you right away. If you come in with stomach pains, you'll wait longer. Now if you live outside of Toronto, like in Brampton, or Mississauga, or Ajax, they might be a little less, not sure.
Our biggest city, Toronto, is much smaller than most american cities. Toronto has a rough population of about 2.48 million, and about 5 million in the greater toronto area. So considering most of the country live in rural areas, the wait time is much shorter. I know people who live in windsor, and parts like that, who wait about 20 minutes for an emerg patient.
To put this in prespective, I dont even know the name of my insurance company. I dont think we even have insurance companies here. Im pretty sure you just need a health card.
Imgaine a parent, a family member, being REALLY sick, needing multiply operations, and never even seeing a report, not even seeing the amount it costs, or even who paid for it. Its a wonderful system, probably why it boggles me that America is one of the only developed countries that dont have universal health care. But then again, our politicans/ policy makers arent as rich as yours are.
Varun,
Canada's health system is constantly ranked amongst the best in the planet (source: maclean, canada's TIME magaznie, can be given upon request). The wait times is a criticism that is somewhat valid, but defintely exaggerated.
First off, in Canada, it doesnt matter how much money you have. You cant pay for better, or worst health care, as per the Canada Health Act. So you can be a billionaire, or you can be a a mother of 5 on wealthfare, you wait in the same lines, to see the same physicians, and recieve the same care. So, the benefit of universal free healthcare, like in Canada, like in Eurpoe is that everyone recieves the same care, and everyone recieves care necessary. It is not dependent on your pocket book.
Your not feeling well, or you see a bump that you want to get checked out, go to your family doctor, who depending on the doc, with appointment you can see in less than 10 minutes. He can refer you anything, xrays, biopsy's, MRI's, surgery whatever, you never have to contact your insurance company, nothing gets sent to your house regarding the operation, you go there do your thing and leave, everything is taken care of. It provides a more healthier country, a more beneficial work force.
The waiting times depends on where you live. If you live in Toronto, it will take you longer. An emerg visit depending on the time of day can go from 30 mins- 3 +hours. They prioritize your visit. So if you come in with chest pains and low vitals, they are admit you right away. If you come in with stomach pains, you'll wait longer. Now if you live outside of Toronto, like in Brampton, or Mississauga, or Ajax, they might be a little less, not sure.
Our biggest city, Toronto, is much smaller than most american cities. Toronto has a rough population of about 2.48 million, and about 5 million in the greater toronto area. So considering most of the country live in rural areas, the wait time is much shorter. I know people who live in windsor, and parts like that, who wait about 20 minutes for an emerg patient.
To put this in prespective, I dont even know the name of my insurance company. I dont think we even have insurance companies here. Im pretty sure you just need a health card.
Imgaine a parent, a family member, being REALLY sick, needing multiply operations, and never even seeing a report, not even seeing the amount it costs, or even who paid for it. Its a wonderful system, probably why it boggles me that America is one of the only developed countries that dont have universal health care. But then again, our politicans/ policy makers arent as rich as yours are.
What are the downsides to moving to Canada or Switzerland? They seem like havens (Switz. more so seems like a haven, a sanctuary). Am I just disillusioned here? Help me out oh all ye knowledgeable ones.
Also, Jeeti says Obama will raise taxes like no other. However, if we are to believe what's illustrated in Saleem's chart, then he is only raising taxes for people with incomes of $600,000 and over - the top 1%.
so is he really raising taxes like hell? not the income tax, at least, hes only raising that for the top 1%
Also, Jeeti says Obama will raise taxes like no other. However, if we are to believe what's illustrated in Saleem's chart, then he is only raising taxes for people with incomes of $600,000 and over - the top 1%.
so is he really raising taxes like hell? not the income tax, at least, hes only raising that for the top 1%
pluthra
Member
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ok so, im not sure if this is accurate...but isn't there a bracket or an amount that once when reaches they don't pay for a certain program.....any1 in payroll accounting know??? but its like once your accumulated pay has reached $7000 (which I think the number is wrong) you don't have to pay towards medicare (well not medicare but im just using it as an example)
also, the rich and wealthy sure there taxes don't seem like alot, but they also gotta pay an inheritance tax
but what about tax refunds??? sure taxes withhold a lot, but what about when people get a tax refund? ok sure we wouldnt really benefit from tax returns at this age because we're all considered independent we dont' donate, etc, etc ,etc....i like this statment: "However, some people use the tax refund as a simple "savings plan" where they're pleasantly surprised to get money back each year (even though it is excess money that they paid earlier in the year)." (wiki-tax refund) but it encourages people to become smarter investors, I know alot of the times when people do recieve a tax refund they will save it, which is good for them-and sure hurts the econ but at least when they get older or they get struck by a crisis they have some money that they can look upon)
can some1 explain the canadian tax system futher...its just one tax rate among all income brackets? how beneficial is that?...and also canada is able to focus on keeping human resources--which would be nicer if we decided to focus on that as well, but they don't really have threats or any assumed threats...the US just has to keep living in this state where everything is a threat-which maybe if we got past this phase the country could actually focus on more issues
also i think health issues are lame (notice how today people are like oh man im getting sick-let me head to the doctor-thats just lame I dont think you really need to head to the doctor if you have a mild cough, or even need to take an advil for a mild fever-thats just how the medicine field makes money-making people feel as if medicine can cure any problem they have-how bout those old remedies? or just being a bit more optimistic aight)
also, since the budget isn't really approved by very many at all; what are some actions that can be taken to improve it, what departments/programs should funding go into?
also, the rich and wealthy sure there taxes don't seem like alot, but they also gotta pay an inheritance tax
but what about tax refunds??? sure taxes withhold a lot, but what about when people get a tax refund? ok sure we wouldnt really benefit from tax returns at this age because we're all considered independent we dont' donate, etc, etc ,etc....i like this statment: "However, some people use the tax refund as a simple "savings plan" where they're pleasantly surprised to get money back each year (even though it is excess money that they paid earlier in the year)." (wiki-tax refund) but it encourages people to become smarter investors, I know alot of the times when people do recieve a tax refund they will save it, which is good for them-and sure hurts the econ but at least when they get older or they get struck by a crisis they have some money that they can look upon)
can some1 explain the canadian tax system futher...its just one tax rate among all income brackets? how beneficial is that?...and also canada is able to focus on keeping human resources--which would be nicer if we decided to focus on that as well, but they don't really have threats or any assumed threats...the US just has to keep living in this state where everything is a threat-which maybe if we got past this phase the country could actually focus on more issues
also i think health issues are lame (notice how today people are like oh man im getting sick-let me head to the doctor-thats just lame I dont think you really need to head to the doctor if you have a mild cough, or even need to take an advil for a mild fever-thats just how the medicine field makes money-making people feel as if medicine can cure any problem they have-how bout those old remedies? or just being a bit more optimistic aight)
also, since the budget isn't really approved by very many at all; what are some actions that can be taken to improve it, what departments/programs should funding go into?
Summy
New Member
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There are plenty of downsides to living in Canada. Because it is so multicultural, you have old time white canada who refuses to accept the change in the work force and the successful immigrants, so canada does have an underground problem of the treatment of miniorities in the work force. That wouldnt be the case as much in switzerland. But yeah, its a pretty awesome place to love, other than that, if you dont live in Toronto, you have no teams to cheer for except for hockey. Oh and celine dion.
------------
I like Parul, sometimes the way she puts stuff, your like "what the fateh", but then you realize her thoughts and intentions are good.
Firstly, just to explain the canadian tax system for americans. Okay, so each purchase, no matter what, you get taxed. Go and buy a 1.00 choclate bar, with tax, it will come up to 1.13. You go out and buy a car, for 50,000, you will be taxed 13% of that purchase. This is independent and separate to your income tax.
Your income tax, you file once a year. You have tax brackets in Canada. I think the numbers are 15% up to 40,000, then 22% up to I think it is 75,000, and then some number above that. But the way it works is different than what Obama is purposing. Lets say I make 60,000/ year. I will pay 15% the 40,000 (maximum allowed in first bracket) and then 22% out the remaining balance (20,000). Lets say I make 150,000/year... Well then I will pay 15% of 40,000, then 22% of 35,000, the the remaining percentage will be paid by the next brackets. So you pay by each bracket you are above. So its not like your paying 22% of 70,000. Your paying 22% of 30,000, and 15% or 40,000... get it?
Your income tax is different from the provinical and government tax you pay with each purpose (to confuse things, they are included in the same tax refund/report, but are separate). Its not the same taxation for each bracket.
---
Parul, you say that Canada doesnt have any real threats, which is correct, but as a key member of the international community, we, and pretty much the whole world see that as a problem you guys created. I mean, another downside of Canada is the COMPLETE disassoication we want from Americans. They believe americans are inferior, gun totting freedom fries eating cowboys. Canada prides itself on being part of the neutral international community. Our roles in the UN, and peace keeping efforts.
Maybe of your government didnt pimp out countries, and your foreign policy wasnt based on stealing other country's natural resources like oil (be it through a faulty war, or through paying off governments) you wouldnt have such a problem of national security. Its like what did people think? You had 19 hijackers who flew into a NY trade towers, and your response is go into Afghanistan, leave it in ruins for the international community to clean up, then move to another country, throw it into civil war, massacare its civilians and then say "we have national security problem", YEAH NO SHIT SHERLOCK.
American foreign policy has been pimping out the little man since WWII, and I guess it comes with the territory of being the world power, but I mean, if the government raises taxes to "protect you", its the government protecting you guys, from the problems that your OWN government createed.
I know in the US, you are bombarded with the news who slates these people as ones against freedom, and barbaric and horrible humans, but its really not the case. It is hard to believe that the world community is so against ameriacan ideals because of their policy across the world. People think when the world community hates the US for what they did, they are inevitably jealous of the success of the country, when really, it is their actions around the world.
If Canada decided to invade a country, a) our army is built enough for a big snow storm never mind an invasion, and b) our government would be impeached and parliament hill would go in flames. Canada is an international country, who doesnt go in to a country without international governing approvals. Those governing bodies tend to make decent decisions on the safety of the country that may be invaded (Ie- refusing America's entry into Iraq).
----
re: health issues, parul you may think that it is lame for someone to check small issues, but it is awesome. A small bump that you may put off inthe states because of the xray's, and mri's it takes to evaluate, may be caught at an earlier stage in Canada. We also assume that the citizens know better when to take medicine for a cough, and not rush to the merg (prob why we have fam doctors, and walk in clinics like meistro said)
Its an important peace of mind to have. Something the WHOLE world pracitces except for US.
----
The biggest problem is washington and special interest groups. Doctors, and the health execs make BILLIONS, and privatized health care is a lot of money. Its not good for the majority, the middle class, and those people ARE NOT running washington. Private companies own the people who make policy for the masses, America is a big company providing services not care.
------------
I like Parul, sometimes the way she puts stuff, your like "what the fateh", but then you realize her thoughts and intentions are good.
Firstly, just to explain the canadian tax system for americans. Okay, so each purchase, no matter what, you get taxed. Go and buy a 1.00 choclate bar, with tax, it will come up to 1.13. You go out and buy a car, for 50,000, you will be taxed 13% of that purchase. This is independent and separate to your income tax.
Your income tax, you file once a year. You have tax brackets in Canada. I think the numbers are 15% up to 40,000, then 22% up to I think it is 75,000, and then some number above that. But the way it works is different than what Obama is purposing. Lets say I make 60,000/ year. I will pay 15% the 40,000 (maximum allowed in first bracket) and then 22% out the remaining balance (20,000). Lets say I make 150,000/year... Well then I will pay 15% of 40,000, then 22% of 35,000, the the remaining percentage will be paid by the next brackets. So you pay by each bracket you are above. So its not like your paying 22% of 70,000. Your paying 22% of 30,000, and 15% or 40,000... get it?
Your income tax is different from the provinical and government tax you pay with each purpose (to confuse things, they are included in the same tax refund/report, but are separate). Its not the same taxation for each bracket.
---
Parul, you say that Canada doesnt have any real threats, which is correct, but as a key member of the international community, we, and pretty much the whole world see that as a problem you guys created. I mean, another downside of Canada is the COMPLETE disassoication we want from Americans. They believe americans are inferior, gun totting freedom fries eating cowboys. Canada prides itself on being part of the neutral international community. Our roles in the UN, and peace keeping efforts.
Maybe of your government didnt pimp out countries, and your foreign policy wasnt based on stealing other country's natural resources like oil (be it through a faulty war, or through paying off governments) you wouldnt have such a problem of national security. Its like what did people think? You had 19 hijackers who flew into a NY trade towers, and your response is go into Afghanistan, leave it in ruins for the international community to clean up, then move to another country, throw it into civil war, massacare its civilians and then say "we have national security problem", YEAH NO SHIT SHERLOCK.
American foreign policy has been pimping out the little man since WWII, and I guess it comes with the territory of being the world power, but I mean, if the government raises taxes to "protect you", its the government protecting you guys, from the problems that your OWN government createed.
I know in the US, you are bombarded with the news who slates these people as ones against freedom, and barbaric and horrible humans, but its really not the case. It is hard to believe that the world community is so against ameriacan ideals because of their policy across the world. People think when the world community hates the US for what they did, they are inevitably jealous of the success of the country, when really, it is their actions around the world.
If Canada decided to invade a country, a) our army is built enough for a big snow storm never mind an invasion, and b) our government would be impeached and parliament hill would go in flames. Canada is an international country, who doesnt go in to a country without international governing approvals. Those governing bodies tend to make decent decisions on the safety of the country that may be invaded (Ie- refusing America's entry into Iraq).
----
re: health issues, parul you may think that it is lame for someone to check small issues, but it is awesome. A small bump that you may put off inthe states because of the xray's, and mri's it takes to evaluate, may be caught at an earlier stage in Canada. We also assume that the citizens know better when to take medicine for a cough, and not rush to the merg (prob why we have fam doctors, and walk in clinics like meistro said)
Its an important peace of mind to have. Something the WHOLE world pracitces except for US.
----
The biggest problem is washington and special interest groups. Doctors, and the health execs make BILLIONS, and privatized health care is a lot of money. Its not good for the majority, the middle class, and those people ARE NOT running washington. Private companies own the people who make policy for the masses, America is a big company providing services not care.
pluthra
Member
- Messages
- 296
hey that doesnt seem too bad (i gotta go play out a few numbers to tell u exactly what i think of it)Summy said:
2) let me get to the negatives: stop referin to the US as my country I just live here because really I have no choice!!!! and i dont side w/ the "inferior, gun totting freedom fries eating cowboys"
3) ur post was hilarious- because it was serious and then it goes no duh SHERLOCK- i dunno y but thats the best way ive heard any1 sum up the US
and "what the fateh"?????" i don't say thattt
4) interest groups-aight sure some are just terrible, and capitalistic and etc etc etc.....but now w/out them are the voices of americans ever gonna be heard-we kinda do have to rely on 'em rite?
5) i have 1 last point-in order to implement a new tax system what would it require for a country?
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Tax refunds are the stupidest form of a savings plan. All it means is that you paid too much taxes throughout the year, which the US Gov't gladly held onto, made interest on. Then a year later, they gave you your money back, and people treat it like it's free money and buy a TV with it. It was your money all along, but held from you.Parul said:
pluthra
Member
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- 296
ok sure its our money withheld, but sometimes it shud be withheld from us; if people had less taken out of taxes- then there budgets wud be immensely skewed-people would spend more on groceries-> more obesity when really wow some of those shopping carts cud do w/out all the junk food; spending less on useless personal items; sure now we have more disposable income-but that means ok now I have more I can spend more; and whatever I do not spend I will save; rather than right now when we're expected to save like 20-30% of your pay (i'm makin up numbers again-there not actual statistics); but i like the fact that we have to be somewhat forced into saving (well not due to the bad economy-that fact i dont like)
