Sportsmanship in the bhangra scene

[Meistro]

Turbo, I completely agree with everything you stated. Well said bro.

 

[Vick]

Turbo I agree with what you say, but banning teams is almost impossible... They can always change names... What you need to do is ban CAPTAINS, that will send a real message to the teams... Banning something or the other is only way I see teams making any changes in attitude... I guess registration packets from now on should also include certain clauses to protect the committee, shit like, "failure to act in an appropiate manner judged by the committee is enough reason to revoke any competition money" or something like that... Just imagine if Vic from SGPD is banned for a year from all competitions across North America, you think SGPD will finally grow up? I'd put a million dollars on it... and other captains will take notice and make sure that their teams dont act like a bunch of assholes on stage...

 

[Basim]

Competitions shouldn't have to deal with both sides. When you get a registration packet, it always says on there that you'll have to live with the judges decision and it outlines in there somewhere how you are suppose to act. It always says teams that are caught fighting or other shit will be disqualified. It also says that it is the captain's responsibility to relay that information to his team. That's why they have you SIGN everyone's name on that sheet to say that you agree to it. If a team breaks that contract and starts shit, I say kick them outta the competition and ban their ass for life. Fuck the bullshit. Organizers don't put comps on and audience don't pay money to come see a bunch of immature little boys fight over who should have won.

If you honestly let your life be dependent on who won and who beat who in a bhangra competition, then you are one sad individual. There is way more important shit going on in this world.

If that truly happened at Masti where some team dropped a check on stage, that's blatant disrespect. I would have disqualified them right there and then and given the placing to the next team. Sportsmanship is bigger than all of us. Shit doesn't always go your way. You have to learn to live with it. Competitions need to start being more strict in what they allow and don't allow.

I agree Turbo. I honestly love it when competition organizers PWN disrespectful teams/people! It puts a big smile on my face ;D Everyone (no matter how "big" or "small" of a team you're on) should be courteous to the organizers... most competitions take hell of a lot more time putting together a competition (forming registration packets, seeking sponsors, booking a venue, arranging team accommodations, promoting/attracting a crowd, setting up the rehearsal times/show schedule, etc etc) than a team does working on their routine from start-to-finish. Performing at a competition is a PRIVILEGE, not a RIGHT any team has.

It's not only the job of the captain to put his/her team through "Bhangra & Modern Day Ethics 101," but to also enforce the same principals in everything else the team does together. Captains should cut team members who cannot follow simple rules of behavior.

Once a entire groups of performers start getting banned for life (ban each individual) from big competitions, it will certainly make an impact on the rest of the performers/teams in the bhangra world.

Someone might shoot me for this but I don't understand why people get so competitive with Bhangra..I'm sorry but aren't you guys suppose to be showing your love and appreciation for the culture and dance? There is more to life than Bhangra..honestly, I promise.

+111111... You promise me there is more Gabar?? 8)


~ Basim

 

[H.S.]

Well, if we can point fingers at SGPD and NJ then we also gotta flip the switch and ask the competition organizers whats the point of judges if theres gonna be ties?

I think the organizers kinda knew what was going to happen but still did it. Why tie 2 teams? Especially if a. you know both teams and their reactions b.having a tie is gonna make ur comp and judges look bad. Also Masti has personal relationships with both teams, and choosing one over the other, would cause tension b/w the team that didnt win. Thats why at groundshaker, their also was a tie.

I do feel that one team was slightly more nervous as 1st place was gonna be announced, while the other team looked more confident, as in we got this. And the team that was the confident one, had a bigger reaction to the tie. Plus when it comes to these teams, it goes beyond bhangra and their personal lives get involved, which cause a bigger reaction when ties occur, cause it's personal. Even PANJ had a personal goal to beat a certain team

So even tho the teams reactions were over the top and disrespectful, what the organizers did also was disrespectful to the dancers and all the hardwork that goes into making bhangra sets. Makes you question, why compete if ties is all their gonna get?

 

[Vick]

Well, if we can point fingers at SGPD and NJ then we also gotta flip the switch and ask the competition organizers whats the point of judges if theres gonna be ties?

I've heard that one team actually got more points than the other team but they still tied them for 1st. I think the organizers kinda knew what was going to happen but still did it. Why tie 2 teams? Especially if a. theres a difference in scores, b. you know both teams and their reactions c.having a tie is gonna make ur comp and judges look bad. Also Masti has personal relationships with both teams, and choosing one over the other, would cause tension b/w the team that didnt win. Thats why at groundshaker, their also was a tie.

I do feel that one team was slightly more nervous as 1st place was gonna be announced, while the other team looked more confident, as in we got this. And the team that was the confident one, had a bigger reaction to the tie. Plus when it comes to these teams, it goes beyond bhangra and their personal lives get involved, which cause a bigger reaction when ties occur, cause it's personal. Even PANJ had a personal goal to beat a certain team

So even tho the teams reactions were over the top and disrespectful, what the organizers did also was disrespectful to the dancers and all the hardwork that goes into making bhangra sets. Makes you question, why compete if ties is all their gonna get?

So you're saying the competition was rigged? If that highlighted part is true, that just completes changes everything discussed over the past day or so...

 

[Vic]

There is a lot to this situation. I will not bash NJ or Masti committee. The discussion is good. Keep it going, but please keep in mind that there is a lot more under it all then any of you know.

continue...

 

[rajkaran]

Cha upsets my tummy.

Punjabi cha /at gurudwara is more milk and sugar than caffeine (not that i'm complaining at all). Dont be afraid.

now that's the good stuff...

ok sorry for the sidetrack

 

[Waleed]

Just imagine if Vic from SGPD is banned for a year from all competitions across North America, you think SGPD will finally grow up?

Vick bro, I would stay away from calling people out like that. We still don't know the full story with Masti and who is truly at fault. From what I can gather the teams were upset that there was a tie as they were told in advance there would be no tie. It's too early to point fingers and discredit the hard work all the teams put in to providing us with entertaining routines. I would reserve my judgment until someone representing a team or the organizers gives us their version of the story.

Regardless, I don't want this to turn in to a Masti thread, rather, I'd like to hear more about what can be done to encourage good sportsmanship at competitions in general. I do agree that the burden of following through with this lies with the captains/coaches & team managers. I'm thinking about all the families,youth and community members who come to a bhangra competition for their first time and what impressions they take away of the bhangra scene when they see poor sportsmanship. The immature actions of a few individuals has the potential to tarnish the image of all bhangra dancers.

 

[Kaur]

Just imagine if Vic from SGPD is banned for a year from all competitions across North America, you think SGPD will finally grow up? ...

Hahahhaha,first off you dont know how much vic was at fault so no point of assuming things, secondly the team wouldnt go without vic, and third those morons would tear apart the whole building without vic, he keeps them in line

 

[Bhangra Masti]

As we stated in the other thread:

Just to clear everything up, Bhangra Masti Committee did not have anything to do with the TIE. After the mixer was over, the committee had a meeting with the judges and it was clearly stated to them that there should be no TIES in any of the categories because it causes HAVOC between teams. If the judges felt it was a tie, that was thier decision given to the committee and the decision was presented in front of the audience.

Having a tie does not resolve everything but causes more work for the committee/organizers: making a new trophy, making more medals etc.

We will not comment on what happened between SGPD & Nachdi Jawani on the stage or backstage at this point as we respect every team's privacy. However, We would like to make this CLEAR to everyone that Canadian Punjabi Dance Academy or Shan-E-Punjab Bhangra Team does NOT have any personal relationships or favorism with SGPD or Nachdi Jawani.

 

[TheBraveOne]

The reason bhangra teams here in toronto argue over placing is because of EGO. They just want to say we are the best and thats it, nobody can beat us. They no longer do it for the fun or the promotion of punjabi culture, if they did they wouldnt care about placings. These teams have to remember why we smile in bhangra, its to showcase the joy in our lifestyle, the love in our culture, and most importantly to put a smile on the faces who watch us. People definitaly smile and enjoy when they see teams like NJ and SGPD perform at weddings and comps. When both sgpd and nj both know they do this for people, that they are also doing a type of seva by bringing joy to people, what more do they want?? why throw the tantrums when you dont get first place?? Even if sgpd or nj came in second i was still going to be happy with both performances, i wasnt going to say one team is better than another... it could be the complete opposite result the next time. So my request to all such teams is that please do it for our culture, keep our culture alive, pass it on and please teach good sportsmanship for our coming generations.

 

[Saleem]

Well, if we can point fingers at SGPD and NJ then we also gotta flip the switch and ask the competition organizers whats the point of judges if theres gonna be ties?

I've heard that one team actually got more points than the other team but they still tied them for 1st. I think the organizers kinda knew what was going to happen but still did it. Why tie 2 teams? Especially if a. theres a difference in scores, b. you know both teams and their reactions c.having a tie is gonna make ur comp and judges look bad. Also Masti has personal relationships with both teams, and choosing one over the other, would cause tension b/w the team that didnt win. Thats why at groundshaker, their also was a tie.

I do feel that one team was slightly more nervous as 1st place was gonna be announced, while the other team looked more confident, as in we got this. And the team that was the confident one, had a bigger reaction to the tie. Plus when it comes to these teams, it goes beyond bhangra and their personal lives get involved, which cause a bigger reaction when ties occur, cause it's personal. Even PANJ had a personal goal to beat a certain team

So even tho the teams reactions were over the top and disrespectful, what the organizers did also was disrespectful to the dancers and all the hardwork that goes into making bhangra sets. Makes you question, why compete if ties is all their gonna get?

So you're saying the competition was rigged? If that highlighted part is true, that just completes changes everything discussed over the past day or so...

Two things. A) I confirmed with another person to make sure I heard correctly -- the judge himself said onstage that the two teams were apart by only 3 points and thus they tied them. So H.S. is neither starting beef nor false.

B) Although the prime example here is what happened at Masti, let's steer the convo to the issue at large, not the details of Masti all over.

 

[Kush]

I meant to post this earlier. I was thinking along the lines of the punishment, but its pointless. Vick mentioned alot of the reasons why (changing team names, etc), but unlike say, the NBA, there is noone to enforce any punishment. For the sake of the hypothetical situation, lets use Khalsa Junction. Easily one of the most known teams to ever hit the bhangra circuit. Lets say they got out of hand at a competition, with sportsmanship, or anything. Let's say there is a call to ban the team from a competition. You think that 90% of comps are going to enforce this??? Big name teams, like KJ, SGPD, NJ, SF, Empire and many others put asses in seats. There are certain teams that, when I see them in a line up, i'm immediately thrilled and wish/decide to attend the comp. Let's say we ban a captain. Upon their application to a competition, who is gonna say "Oh we'd like to invite you to compete, but so-and-so can't dance". I would expect the whole team to pull out.

I don't know. I think that there is very little that can be done about these situations, and its unfortunate that they ahve to occur. Competitive spirit never hurt anyone, but its how this is channeled that makes the difference. It's gonna be on the people on teams to uphold this standard. No way to enforce this really, unless we establish a league of competitions or something like that.

 

[faizan]

Teams can learn a thing or two from some of the o.g. cali teams...Sher, soormay, lbc...great attitudes...lbc came all the way to nyc to perform at nyc addiction an AWFUL competition for "charity"...they came in 2nd, and never got paid...and they never once bitched, and went to the after party and chilled with my team...sher foundation and soormay, have been robbed so many times over the years, never complaints...i salute the cali veterans for setting great examples...

 

[Meistro]

Honestly, I know a lot of teams that go to competitions, sure to compete, but also to interact, to meet other people with the same interests, to travel to new cities, to spread your team's name. Yes, at the end of the day its a competition, a friendly competition. It doesn't make sense when people say "Well its a competition, we compete to win! And if you dance to spread "cultural awareness" go open up a workshop showcasing Bhangra and it's relation to the Punjabi culture". If thats your mentality, then sadly, you have lost the whole concept of what Bhangra means to our generation. We are a generation who mostly grew up in north america. Sure, in India they probably compete like its basketball, football, etc. Here, we compete, but we do it to uphold our culture, to stay connected, to learn. Winning a competition is such a small part of the whole weekend. Nobody cares who won when you're at the afterparty enjoying yourself with other people who share your passion. Its all about having a camaraderie amongst each other.

 

[Mukandpuria]

ok so i actually read all these comments and something was bothering me....first of this is not an attack on NJ or Shaan E....i have tremendous amount of respect for both academy's and their founders....when ever there is a judge at a competitions and he has danced on a team or at one point associated with a team and that team places...people go nuts and say conflict of interest....Now i am not from Toronto, but i did visit both academy's and both academy's were very brotherly. Its like they both are always in touch, founders of the academy's are close friends and have great amount of respect for each other...as well as they were well connected....so why are people not calling the two academy's out on this....Shaan-E tied wit SGPD at GS and NJ tied with SGPD at Masti...i know Masti recently posted that their is no special treatment with either SGPD or NJ.. but its kinda of sketchy...i understand that Masti has no control of the judging but could it be possible that the judges know about the two academy's relationship? could the judges be the same from GS......it just seems like there is a lot of politics in play.....again no disrespect to the academy's...but just something that donned on me..i would love to hear someone respond to this...just curious...again i am not saying the academy's fixed it, but it could be possible that the judges could know about their relationship, since one of the judges was the same from GS....Boston Bhangra was about to have a tie but we explicitly told the judges to reevaluate the scores and really think about the performances weather it gets down to the last decimal point...its not fair to the teams....In my opinion Masti should have told the judges to reevaluate the score and they could have done it without being bias...why didn't they?

i understand if both organization say there is no favoritism, but still it makes people wonder, if there is a conflict of interest competitions should really be cautious about who they accept to the competition in order to cover their asses...i am not going to say any more than this.

 

[GavinJ.]

Why is everyone stressed .. half hte people dont know whats happening
me being one of them but no need to keep onn going about it stick too just talkin
bout bhangra ..

 

[Vick]

I used Vic as an example because he's one of the "higher" profile captains around... I'm not saying he initiated anything, that wasn't my point... I wasn't calling Vic out, just read the statement again, it says "Just imagine"... Trust me, I make it pretty damn clear when I call someone out... All it takes is one committee to put their foot down and not take this BS and the rest will follow... I have no idea who started what, obviously SGPD and NJ don't want to clear it because they keep posting stuff like "you all don't know what happened, blah blah blah", so let the rumors fly... Whichever team it was, should be banned in some form or another like Turbo said earlier, it's that simple...

 

[Waleed]

I used Vic as an example because he's one of the "higher" profile captains around... I'm not saying he initiated anything, that wasn't my point... I wasn't calling Vic out

Point noted.

 

[Vick]

I used Vic as an example because he's one of the "higher" profile captains around... I'm not saying he initiated anything, that wasn't my point... I wasn't calling Vic out

Point noted.

I do listen to the mods every now and then.... haha..