• Bhangra discussion is still going strong. Join us in our Facebook group!

    New user registration has been closed (as it was entirely spam). We encourage you to post in our Facebook group, even if it's a followup to an existing thread. BTF will continue to be archived and hosted here - Saleem

"The Racism in Desism"?

Waleed

New Member
Messages
729
Even though this article is purely based on personal experiences rather than factual research or survey, I still find myself in agreement with the author's point. I've heard some Desi uncles say some straight up racist trash against black people & Latinos (in particular). We also discriminate among punjabis vs gujuratis, pakistani vs indian, muslim vs hindu... the list goes on. Ah Arjun, this is a long discussion.. but valid observation on your part.
 

mafzal

Judge / Dancer
Messages
2,098
Didn't read the article... but yeah a sadly large number of desis are racist against blacks, different kinds of other desis, etc, etc. Only prob is it actually desis? Or are latinos [example] in their own community racist against other groups? Is every group just racist against other groups? In-group/Out-group thing

Sorry not too well thought out

Hmm lemme go think
 

kinnell

*Account Deactivated*
Messages
2,159
In the end, everyone seems to some unconscious bias against every type of person based on appearances. The difference is between those who express these bias vocally and those who try to repress them in an attempt to be tolerant.

But my parents, for the most are pretty tolerant, but say the most random shit. "No BMWs"..etc
 

Meistro

Asi Shounk Nu Karaiyaan Muschaan Kundiyaan...
Messages
2,065
good article. I agree with Kinnell. I think every group has its share of racism. It all depends on how you express it. Desis and asians in general definately tend to repress their opinions. They keep their racism behind closed doors or amongst each other, whereas white, black, and latino people are more open about it. They actually show taunting racism through their body language.
 

kinnell

*Account Deactivated*
Messages
2,159
Mariam said:
What's a "BMW"?
Uhhh.

BMW stands for "Black Muslim or White". My mom is the stereotypical gujju "tolerant" parent. I put "tolerant" in quotations because its okay if people she knows marry or date a "BMW", but not okay if I ever did. My mom always told me to bring home a nice gujju girl, but ever since she began to think that I'm gay, NOW any girl will do. ;D
 

kinnell

*Account Deactivated*
Messages
2,159
Saleem said:
what does your mom have against German engineering? How ridiculous...
/sarcasm
She drives a Benz. Damn thing needs maintenance once every 2 months at least. Stupid German Cars.
 

Somi

Hookah is NOT harmful!
Messages
553
kinnell said:
She drives a Benz. Damn thing needs maintenance once every 2 months at least. Stupid German Cars.
hey I have a German car....they arent stupid! ;D

racism is the same as usual. its not going to go away.
We may try....but its not
somewhere in our head we do it...but i hope in a joking matter (which is wrong too)
Its not just desi's.....believe me....i heard, bet you have to, that every race has made a remark about another race.
its a world matter and its going to be hard to stop how this world thinks.
 

Meistro

Asi Shounk Nu Karaiyaan Muschaan Kundiyaan...
Messages
2,065
i kno in BC (possibly other parts of canada too) they call the native indians "thaikay". Its just a nickname for natives for when punjabi ppl are talking about them in their presence. Thaikay (as in thaiaji) in punjabi means "of the older uncle (father's older brother)"...it makes no sense at all, just a nickname though.
 

yraparla

SwizzeeMusic.com
Messages
2,072
/edit/ Shit, I keep writing these huge ass comments. I think only Summy may write longer ones :( sorry guys, I'll try to keep the next ones shorter.

It's a classic case of 'Othering' which the whole world goes through. Every single group, in any sense of the definition, creates a divide of those in the group and those out of the group (us and them). Particularly in Asia, where there's just so many damn people, you need to create smaller divisions to create a sense of community.

I agree with the author that what he called, 'regional pride' is ok as long as it doesn't become 'regional conceit'. The line is when you cease to appreciate correlation, let's say of economic wealth, education trends, cultural contributions, and begin to see it as causation. "I am not just smart because, as an Indian, there is a community which sets standards on our actions and works hard to limit the potential distractions that poverty and hardship cause....but I am smart simply because I am Indian".

One thing I think is important to note is that a lot of times we're just looking for commonalities or insight into people. I was never once asked if I was north or south indian till coming to college (where there's a large international student body). I think the mindset to ask just came cause you ask because it's a big deal in India. I was also never asked if I was Brahmin until college too. But then I realized that in many cases it's ok, because these are things that, if don't define me, are defining characteristics. Where my parents are from determine what Indian language I may speak, what caste I am may determine whether I am vegetarian or not (I am). I began to see as similar to 'what religion are you' which I think we can all agree is not an egregious question.

So point is not to judge people who ask questions just as you would not want to be judged by your answers. Not everything has to have some ulterior discriminatory motive. Sometimes people are just interested and want some insight.
 

Raashi

New Member
Messages
152
Meistro said:
good article. I agree with Kinnell. I think every group has its share of racism. It all depends on how you express it. Desis and asians in general definately tend to repress their opinions. They keep their racism behind closed doors or amongst each other, whereas white, black, and latino people are more open about it. They actually show taunting racism through their body language.
interesting article--

i agree that lots of times, desis and asians aren't as open about their opinions on this issue where as other groups of people are
 

Summy

New Member
Messages
11
wow. First off, the article is HIGHLY problematic, and in itself a extremely narrow minded view on race relations. It gives the false impression of extending "racism" to an entire people, including in India and its diaspora. Secondly, more alarming than that, is the comments that people have posted here.

First off, racism is a specific and overgeneralized term. If we a prejudice to different communites within India, it is not racism. If a pakistani and an Indian show prejudice to each other, its not racism. Racism, is a term coined to evaluate relations between two seperate races. The problem then become how to define a race. The problems with the article and the responses are so immense, I wouldn't know where to start, but keep in mind, the article itself, is a personal take, and should be taken with any academic accuracy. I would be spit at if I ever wrote something like that.


The problem kind of hinted at in the article is the difference between prejudice in the west compared to the east. Let us assume, the majority of people of Indian descent using this language, in the west, are western born. Scientifically speaking, and socially acceptable theories show, their upbringing differs more with their ancestors, and indians back home, then those of different races in their western country. So, when you look at the sentiment behind racism, and the differences that are being seeked out, it is often do to uneducated people not understanding the similarities vs. the differences. Thats the first thing to note. On average, if you are born here, you are more alike to the "gora" than you are to the punjabi back home.

SWI, claimed that sometimes, we should not look at why they are asking the question, because sometimes their interests may actually be genuine. Now, the fact that the statements he/she used were very obsecure and general is problematic and provide little to no insight on the topic, but let us assume, for one minute, someone claimed when people ask, it is for a genuine neutral reason. Research into race relations of people who are separate race's, but of the same birthplace, show that the differences that people seek out are intentional. Ie- If I am a Indo-Canadian, and I talk to a Afro-Canadian, ask he/she about her caste/upbringing, it is typically because I am seeking out DIS-assoication. So as SWI said that "alot" of time people are looking for similarities goes against any sort of basic research done on this topic, and I think common knowledge will prove that to be false as well.


As far as racism by "desi's" (another highly problematic term) to other race's. Like I said, research shows, it is to feed the need for dis-assoication. Like the Kajol example given, it is to VERIFY (implying already pre-concieved notions) some taxonomic differences between me and you. To be prejudice in its basic sense is to need difference. Kinnell said, everyone has an "uncounscious bias" towards different races. Again, bias can never be unconscious, the need for dis-assoication is an effort delibertly made. Research of why this dis-assocation needs to be made, is vast. The theory I subscribe to is the fact that people who live in a multi-culatural, multi-racial society seek assoication, with their own kind. This is basically Dr. Kinsler's theory, of I think it is Yale, a long ago study steaming back to civil rights days. People seek assoication with their own kind as acceptance is easier to be had, when 'a' and 'b' are similar.




So, I hope people use their language very intelligently, and not just blurt out un-evolved statements. It is way too basic, undeveloped, and worthless to point out that "racism sucks" and it exists. I think for race relations to get better, people need to use the right terms and language, and need to start adding things that are viable, and concrete. It is not longer progressive, it is actually hindering the race relations movement, to be so basic in your thought. Everyone thinks racism is bad, everyone knows it exists, and the repeating of these basic phrases is only compounding the problem of inaction rather than offering a solution.
 
Top